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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 9:01 am 
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Javaman, that is indeed the bigest news west of the Mississippi this morning. Its about time we heard something real from the MWC...I think I can hear the sigh of relief coming from Mr. Benson from here!


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 9:22 am 
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A good take of the Fresno State Point of view. They really are kind of getting screwed!

http://fresnobee.com/columnists/branch/story/7693872p-8597867c.html


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 10:23 am 
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Quote:


I like that moniker...
suitable for all sorts of metaphysical speculation...
and physical (sports) speculation as well...
:D


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 1:57 pm 
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Good point. If one checks out Gunner's old stats on an older thread on attendence in WAC and CUSA vs MWC you'll see that for the schools involved in the current reallignments, MWC offers approximately 10,000 more bodies in stadiums on a regular basis, and larger stadium capacities all round. Only exception is Wyoming.

The reason for this is something I alluded to some weeks earlier. MWC schools are not primarily the second-tier schools the CUSA schools are. They are primary flagship schools that not only have deeper traditions, larger alumni bases, better funding, but also attract the loyalty of those who simply like to root for the state or appropriate religious flagship school... Some of the schools also have territorial exclusivity, which no CUSA school has.

There is no doubt in my mind that even in the current configuration MWC is somewhat better than CUSA; but is this significant enough to bolt geographic convenience for? Only time will tell. If TCU does join MWC however, it sends a very clear national signal that knowledgeable number-crunchers and odds-makers consider MWC a better future BCS bet than CUSA.

:D


Last edited by javaman on Wed Nov 05, 2003 2:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2003 2:08 pm 
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Hello. I'm new to this forum, but I've been reading your posts quite a bit. What do you think about this idea?

TCU and Boise State accept invitations to the MWC, expanding them to 10.

Conference USA reacts and invites Louisiana Tech from the WAC. (They are so far away from other schools anyway.)

WAC replenishes by inviting North Texas and Idaho. (North Texas due to on-field competition. Idaho due to nothing else except regional flair and survival by the WAC).

Sun Belt would have to bring in some of those new Florida Schools (FIU, FAM) and maybe a 1-AA to 1-A move in football (Western Kentucky?).

Just a thought. I really think that Louisiana shouldn't be in the WESTERN athletic conference and Idaho shouldn't be in the Sun Belt.

GO VANDALS! (Well, next year at least ;)


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 8:51 am 
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Here is the take from the SaltLakeTribune this am, and indicates the columnist's sense of things is that TCU will definitely get an invite, and that would be good for MWC. Its only a column opinion though, not an actual newsstory based on sources...

http://www.sltrib.com/2003/Nov/11062003/sports/108752.asp

:D


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 9:46 am 
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VandalFan, welcome aboard. Your ideas seem on target with most conventional thinking, assuming the MWC opts for 10 instead of 9 members. As Javaman alluded to, I'm not completely sold on TCU needing to move to MWC; Though the conference is better, is it that much better than the CUSA that it would get better BCS access while CUSA went without? TCU might look at CUSA as a chance to be regular conference contenders in it's premier sport, playing in a conference championship, bowl games etc., while also enjoying comraderie with the former-SWC brethren.

As perhaps the lone Vandal fan on our boards, what's the true potential of the program there? Many have suggested Idaho drop down and play alongside Montana, especially if the WAC is picked apart. Thoughts?

- - - - - - - - -

Folks, something else I heard discussed on local (ATL) radio is the notion that TCU should wait it out. Once the future of the BCS is clarified over the next year, and after all the other conference shuffling has played out, TCU and the MWC will better understand what they need to do for BCS consideration. TCU could still jump ship in 2005 or 6 if that drastically alters the BCS status of school and conference. Till then, there are social and economic benefits to sitting in CUSA.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2003 10:41 am 
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GunnerFan and VandalFan
I think both the MWC and TCU waiting is an option, but the concern I would have is that if the BCS is going to "give" the BE spot to a conference, that conference better be at it's strongest. In order for the MWC to have it's best shot, they should add TCU, Boise State, Fresno State, and Hawaii. They add the best overall programs in the WAC, the best remaining CUSA program, and Boise has a bowl and a great football program. (Hawaii and TCU bring bowls too!) Fresno has had a blackeye, but they have all of the numbers with ranked MBB and FB, large facilities, demographics, etc. The travel is greater, but the payout might be worth it.


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 07, 2003 1:30 pm 
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GunnerFan,

I think Idaho is viable as a Division I member. Much of the Division I access also has to do with Academics and exposure. I think the the UI is at a much higher level than the I-AA schools in that regard (100 Million in research, 12,000+ students, Engineering & Business programs). We have had football success before and won a bowl game in 1998. I think we were doomed to become bottom feeders because of conference affiliation. The Sun Belt is not a good choice for us. I think that given the choice of Sun Belt or I-AA, we should choose I-AA.

However, the cost of moving down is very difficult. I for one have never heard of any schools that have been forced to move down. Can anyone tell me about how the original I-A, I-AA and DII divisions were started?

I think that if Idaho were to get into the WAC, everything will get better. I think that with the regional conference and closer rivals, we would draw much better in football. I would like to go to a game against Nevada-Reno, New Mexico State or Utah State as opposed to Middle Tennessee, LA-Monroe or LA-Lafayette. I honestly think that we could have success at the I-A level again. Making our attendance would be difficult, but we could go to Martin Stadium if we had to. I think that with a new conference, new athletic director and please a new football coach (Cable is horrible, going 9-34 last 4 years) we would be able to push for an outdoor stadium. I think it could happen. Either that or adding a horseshoe on the Dome, which would raise the seating to 24,500.

I think that if we get into the WAC, we should continue to push for a new stadium and we would have success. If we don't get in and the WAC gets pulled apart, given the alternative (Sun Belt) I think the travel costs alone will kill us. Then we should move back down to I-AA and the Big Sky.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 10:49 pm 
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It seems so logical, there must be a good reason why it hasn't happened yet. That is a solid conference with the possibility for 1 or 2 breakout teams a year that could finish in the top 10, and pound for pound likely the new Big East's equivalent.

So why hasn't it happened yet?


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:28 pm 
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Money...and who has to split it. d**n I hate that! Just bite the bullet and go for the long run.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 11, 2003 1:18 pm 
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Quote:


Boise St should be in the West division with its geography. I would do the divisions a bit differently, adding SMU instead of Hawaii to give TCU a travel partner.

East
New Mexico
Texas Christian
Southern Methodist
Air Force
Colorado St.
Wyoming


West
Bringham Young
Boise St.
UNLV
Fresno St.
Utah
SanDiego St.

Realistically, I don't expect a move to 12 by the MWC. Most likely the move is 9 or 10 because after that the league would start to become dilluted with regards to money, TV and Bowls. SMU would be a good travel partner for TCU and I'm surprised there isn't more talk of the Mustangs.


SMU? That's some dreaming... SMU is lucky to be in Conference USA. I think they'll like it there better than the WAC. As the school that had the dreaded "death penalty," I hope that SMU can use the better CUSA recruiting grounds and rebuild. It would be nice to see a program that has been down for so long to rebuild. (I guess you can see why I'm an Idaho fan!)

I think the MWC will wait on what TCU decides. If they say yes, they will invite them and Boise State. If they say no, they will invite Boise State and Fresno State. I really think that they won't look seriously at Hawaii. I think the original plan when they left the Mega-WAC was to reduce the travel costs and become more regional. Adding Hawaii would stretch them out further yet again. So, one of two things will happen: 1. TCU & Boise State. 2. Boise State & Fresno State.


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