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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 12:42 am 
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bullet, Good analysis and I agree with your reasoning. This should have been, IMO, the way to go, but these were smart people that made this decision (contrary to some WAC, MWC postings). Lets look at maybe why they didn't go that way.

I think the schools you mentioned are the only group that makes sense, there really isn't another group of four to consider. Maybe TCU and another TX school along with two of the above, but that would force the mountain 5 into different divisions, and we can't have that. Sooo, The MWC would have to feel comfortable with ALL these schools in order to make the move. If one school can't get the six votes needed the whole deal falls apart. Each one of them has issues as well. For Hawai'i its geograghy, Nevada and Boise a lack of program depth and history, Fresno scandals, probation, and a checkered past with the MWC members. Which schools did they had a problem with?...who knows.

Now that an acceptable group of four is out, it brings up a whole new list of candidates. Now the Texas schools are fair game since there will be no divisions and the mountain 5 don't need to separate. TCU brings football history (all be it ancient), a recently sucessful fb program and a fairly deep athletic program. It is a logical choice, especially if they can make any inroads into the DFW TV market.

Now for my homer spiel. Fresno has everything that TCU has and already controls its market as you point out. It would have been an ideal addition even if only adding one. So there's the rub. I can't help but think that Fresno was one school that the MWC couldn't get the six votes for inclusion...Not now...Not ever...Not to the MWC. :'( Well, maybe not not ever! ;)


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 8:44 am 
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Let's try to keep these threads to POSTING ARTICLE LINKS and save the other forums for discussions.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 8:53 am 
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I hope you don't think I'm too cruel after what I posted about Fresno State. Its possible they could grow into an 800 pound football Gorrila, with the city Fresno not in contention for a NFL franchise. More likely I think is Fresno State begins to die on the vine as demographics shift, as what happened to San Jose State.


I couldn't disagree with you more. The major advantage that Fresno has is that there is only one BCS conference in its region, the PAC-10, and it certainly appears to me that the Bulldogs have had the No. 1 football team in California outside of the PAC-10 for quite some time. The immediate area in which TCU resides is a large market, but there are two BCS conferences in the region, the Big XII and SEC. In my view the recruiting ground for the MWC is less crowded out in California. California also gets another MWC presence with SDSU already there and UNLV nearby. About the only advantage I can see for TCU over Fresno is that TCU has name recognition from its past association with the Southwest Conference.

If it were me, I'd definitely take Fresno State and Boise State to sew up the mountain state region of the country. You'll never conquer Dallas-Ft. Worth. A kid in Central California is more likely to attend Fresno State, a public school, than a kid in the D/FW area attending a relatively small private school.

TCU's joining the MWC was probably more a rejection of CUSA than a desire to get in the MWC due to the geographic isolation there. I'd probably go along with it if I were a fan of the Horned Frogs because the MWC's a better conference, but it would be a negative to me to be the only team in the Central Time Zone with the nearest conference mate (New Mexico) a 10-hour drive away. From a fan's standpoint, those who follow TCU could take short trips to Tulsa, Dallas, and Houston and therefore see his team in action a lot more than he will in the MWC.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 8:55 am 
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Now for my homer spiel. Fresno has everything that TCU has and already controls its market as you point out. It would have been an ideal addition even if only adding one. So there's the rub. I can't help but think that Fresno was one school that the MWC couldn't get the six votes for inclusion...Not now...Not ever...Not to the MWC. Well, maybe not not ever!


I can't see Fresno NOT inevitably getting into the MWC. Keep the faith. They are a natural fit.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 8:57 am 
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Let's try to keep these threads to POSTING ARTICLE LINKS and save the other forums for discussions.


Sorry. I guess I get so wrapped up in this stuff that sometimes I forget what forum I'm in! There probably won't be very many articles about MWC expansion for a while, and I still can't understand the reasoning for selecting TCU over others. ???



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 9:12 am 
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I have to disagree with you, joedadi, on a number of issues you bring up. First is your "diamond in the rough" theory. Being in a large metro area, especially if it has the NFL and NBA is a detriment to college sports teams. Fans only have limited funds and usually spend them on the pro teams. With the exception of USC and Miami, its difficult to find a successful big time program in an NFL town. It is even more difficult for mid-majors, IMO, as I can't think of one program in an NFL city that has had continued success. You mentioned SJSU and SDSU, both programs that have fallen dramatically since the NFL moved to town. DFW is dominated by the Cowboys, not to mention Texas and A&M.

You are correct that Fresno is no academic powerhouse, but is no slouch either. If your friend has what it takes for the Ivy League, of course he won't choose Fresno St. He also didn't choose Stanford or Cal for that matter, or any MWC school. Fresno will be an intensive doctoral school in 5 years, possibly with a medical school affiliation and can hold its head up with the likes of SDSU, UNLV, and Colorado State.

Yes, there is not much to do in Fresno if you don't get into Yosemite Park, but what does Norman OK, or Lincoln NE offer. Fresno is not all that bad and is one of the fastest growing cities in California.

Fresno has been competitive since I was there, 20 years or so. No NFL is coming to town, ala SJSU. It will continue to be "the only game in town" just like all of the MWC except SDSU and Utah.

No, Fresno State has what it takes, it just needs to clean up its act and attempt to mend some fences. :)



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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 9:51 am 
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Sorry, I got wrapped up too. I'll keep discussions where they belong in the future. ;D


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:28 am 
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As per Quinn's request, I'm moving this discussion forward on the MWC General Realignment thread.


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