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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:57 pm 
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ncaanopaawaa2000 wrote:
Fresno St. Alum wrote:
2013 MWC Champs! Fresno St. 11-1


Congrats to your school Fresno St. Alum, despite losing the last regular-season game, causing the Bulldogs out of the BCS Buster conversation, and also the cancelled no-contest with Colorado due to the Boulder Floods. But that's their best season in its MW tenure since the early 2000's back in the old WAC days.

And a bit topic-related, should the MW have thoughts about expansion or will keep it off for the moment?


I don't think they will expand unless BYU is one of the 2 schools, but I'd like us to get into Texas w/ UTSA and UTEP.

Fresno's best record ever was 11-0-1 in 1985 in the PCAA aka Big West. This was vs. harder competition though.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 5:21 pm 
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Congrats on the MWC championship Fresno !

Yeah, a BCS bowl would 've been sweet, but even if the SJSU game had gone the other way, the voters would find a way to manipulate things to rank you behind UCF,
just to cheat Fresno St. and the MWC out of the bowl money.... You just know it....

So Chris Peterson has moved on, and now we'll see how well Boise St. can sustain their dominance.
My conclusion is that he realized that realignment had settled down, and Boise St. was not going to be invited into a Power 5 conference anytime soon,
so he may as well cash in and take a higher tier coaching job while he was still a hot commodity.

SIMILARLY (to your point), at some point BYU may realize that the PAC-12 or Big XII dream is not happening, at which point they might come back to the MWC
(which is where I happen to think they belong). If the MWC went to 14, I would favor BYU and UTEP.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 09, 2013 9:12 pm 
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tute79 wrote:
Congrats on the MWC championship Fresno !

Yeah, a BCS bowl would 've been sweet, but even if the SJSU game had gone the other way, the voters would find a way to manipulate things to rank you behind UCF,
just to cheat Fresno St. and the MWC out of the bowl money.... You just know it....

So Chris Peterson has moved on, and now we'll see how well Boise St. can sustain their dominance.
My conclusion is that he realized that realignment had settled down, and Boise St. was not going to be invited into a Power 5 conference anytime soon,
so he may as well cash in and take a higher tier coaching job while he was still a hot commodity.

SIMILARLY (to your point), at some point BYU may realize that the PAC-12 or Big XII dream is not happening, at which point they might come back to the MWC
(which is where I happen to think they belong). If the MWC went to 14, I would favor BYU and UTEP.

UCF was an AQ this year (last year of the Big East's AQ) so the only thing that kept them outta a BCS game was SJSU.

And me and FSA both somewhat agree, no expansion (as there is no point on going past 12) w/o BYU. If BYU gives up being Indy, then we'd likely see UTEP as #14.

Though as the SEC, Pac12, and ACC have proved....adding more member to your conference and playing each other less gives the perception that the conference is stronger as you have less crossover games and thus somewhat insulate your divisions from beating up on each other.

UTSA is a growing program that could really do a lot for the MWC like TCU did, plus San Antonio has a Southwesterny feel to them, unlike Dallas or Houston, that would fit in well with the MWC.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:25 am 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
I don't think they will expand unless BYU is one of the 2 schools, but I'd like us to get into Texas w/ UTSA and UTEP.

Fresno's best record ever was 11-0-1 in 1985 in the PCAA aka Big West. This was vs. harder competition though.


Oh, I see your point. If it does plan to expand into Texas, then it would follow the footsteps of the old WAC in terms of geographic footprint. But about your Bulldogs, if only they hadn't lost to San Jose St., they would still be unbeaten thus far in 12 games.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:16 pm 
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The AAC champ (which turned out to be UCF) was granted an automatic qualifier to the BCS Bowls in this final year of the BCS (which grand-fathered the Big East + AAC).

However, the highest-ranked team from a non-BCS quallifier conference would have been given an at-large berth had they finished ranked above any of the 6 BCS AQ champ schools.
In recent years Boise St. (twice), TCU (once ?), Hawaii (once), and NIU (last year) snuck into the BCS in this manner (I think I have this count right, but I may be off one).
So Norhern Illinois and Fresno State were both in the hunt, but dropped below the lowest-ranked BCS AQ-conf. champ (UCF)
in the rankings after SJSU upset Fresno St. and BGSU beat NIU in the MAC Conf. Championship Game.

My point was that the minute any non-AQ team loses a game (even a close one to a quality opponent), the voters jump all over the opportunity to drop them so far in the rankings
that they have ZERO chance of getting a BCS at-large berth.

Next year the highest ranked team from the little 5 is guaranteed an at-large spot, as the BE -> AAC drops down inot the lower tier of the FBS.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 4:24 pm 
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Will the MWC fill Hawaii's place for non-fb sports? There are a ton of great schools all over the west coast. What do y'all think they are waiting for? Or, does it not even make sense financially with a great school and great market?


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:17 pm 
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mozilla wrote:
Will the MWC fill Hawaii's place for non-fb sports? There are a ton of great schools all over the west coast. What do y'all think they are waiting for? Or, does it not even make sense financially with a great school and great market?

Doubt it would happen we already rejected BYU for all sports/except fb. So if we ever went to 12 for bball that would be the 1st and only school that we'd revisit that with.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 11:39 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
mozilla wrote:
Will the MWC fill Hawaii's place for non-fb sports? There are a ton of great schools all over the west coast. What do y'all think they are waiting for? Or, does it not even make sense financially with a great school and great market?

Doubt it would happen we already rejected BYU for all sports/except fb. So if we ever went to 12 for bball that would be the 1st and only school that we'd revisit that with.

There was a rumor about Gonzaga for awhile...if you think about it, it makes sense as it's the only way either (Zags or MWC) could increase their quality of ball conference. (Outside of BYU). And this doesn't go against their all or nothing stance that the MWC took with BYU since they don't play fb.

Honestly if they went to 14 with BYU I'd like to think they'd try to get the Zags (who could still play asthma Mary's OOC) to offset Hawaii).

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:03 am 
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tkalmus wrote:
Fresno St. Alum wrote:
mozilla wrote:
Will the MWC fill Hawaii's place for non-fb sports? There are a ton of great schools all over the west coast. What do y'all think they are waiting for? Or, does it not even make sense financially with a great school and great market?

Doubt it would happen we already rejected BYU for all sports/except fb. So if we ever went to 12 for bball that would be the 1st and only school that we'd revisit that with.

There was a rumor about Gonzaga for awhile...if you think about it, it makes sense as it's the only way either (Zags or MWC) could increase their quality of ball conference. (Outside of BYU). And this doesn't go against their all or nothing stance that the MWC took with BYU since they don't play fb.

Honestly if they went to 14 with BYU I'd like to think they'd try to get the Zags (who could still play asthma Mary's OOC) to offset Hawaii).


I can't understand why such a quality school as Gonzaga would be left out of the MWC. I don't really care what BYU does....those dudes are on a course of their own. But, for the MWC not to look at Gonzaga is really short sighted.
The situation reminds me of Texas and Texas AnM. AnM just wouldn't make a move without seeing UT do it first. Eventually that wore AnM down...and they finally did something about it. When will the MWC make a move without BYU permission or example. The MWC needs to stop worrying about BYU and move on....and upward. That's what Utah did....they just mashed down on the gas peddle and passed BYU all the way to the Pac 12. 'See Ya' BYU' was the bumper sticker the Cougars saw.

The MWC first worries about travel...but, them adds Hawaii...the furthest school from mainland America???
Then BYU seems to pull most of the strings.
Then when teams leave(sdsu, bsu)...the Conf. doesn't even know if they want them back....but, then they make it back in.
AirForce wants a smaller and cheaper conference to participate in....will they take off and go soon?
It just seems like the MWC has trouble knowing what they want, exactly.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:29 am 
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mozilla wrote:
tkalmus wrote:
Fresno St. Alum wrote:
mozilla wrote:
Will the MWC fill Hawaii's place for non-fb sports? There are a ton of great schools all over the west coast. What do y'all think they are waiting for? Or, does it not even make sense financially with a great school and great market?

Doubt it would happen we already rejected BYU for all sports/except fb. So if we ever went to 12 for bball that would be the 1st and only school that we'd revisit that with.

There was a rumor about Gonzaga for awhile...if you think about it, it makes sense as it's the only way either (Zags or MWC) could increase their quality of ball conference. (Outside of BYU). And this doesn't go against their all or nothing stance that the MWC took with BYU since they don't play fb.

Honestly if they went to 14 with BYU I'd like to think they'd try to get the Zags (who could still play asthma Mary's OOC) to offset Hawaii).


I can't understand why such a quality school as Gonzaga would be left out of the MWC. I don't really care what BYU does....those dudes are on a course of their own. But, for the MWC not to look at Gonzaga is really short sighted.
The situation reminds me of Texas and Texas AnM. AnM just wouldn't make a move without seeing UT do it first. Eventually that wore AnM down...and they finally did something about it. When will the MWC make a move without BYU permission or example. The MWC needs to stop worrying about BYU and move on....and upward. That's what Utah did....they just mashed down on the gas peddle and passed BYU all the way to the Pac 12. 'See Ya' BYU' was the bumper sticker the Cougars saw.

The MWC first worries about travel...but, them adds Hawaii...the furthest school from mainland America???
Then BYU seems to pull most of the strings.
Then when teams leave(sdsu, bsu)...the Conf. doesn't even know if they want them back....but, then they make it back in.
AirForce wants a smaller and cheaper conference to participate in....will they take off and go soon?
It just seems like the MWC has trouble knowing what they want, exactly.


Well the Zags may have been interested (I beleive their was a blog post about it, on their SB nation site ?the shoe fits?) prior to BYU joining their conference but now with BYU and St Marys they seem to be content. If BYU was to leave I think you would see more interest in them possibly moving. But the reason they dont jump is that they'd be the only true private school in the sea of public school that is the MWC (omitting AFA for obvious reasons). They fit better at the moment in the WCC.

The Hawaii add literally is just for 5 games a year. It really has no influence on travel for 98% of the MW.

Air Force, who is not competitive in sports other than fb, was considering leaving the MWC to join BSU/SDSU/Navy in the AAC as it would be a win/win (better fb conference/easier non-fb conference). And while they could still technically do that, most likely they would stay in the MWC as a fb only now (which could work out).

The MWC has its CCG so they are happy for now, and unless BYU wants to come back or something major happens in realignment I don't see any action until maybe just before their new TV deal (in 2018? I think).

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:41 am 
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To me, Gonzaga is a different animal. Private, Catholic, no football, noted for an outstanding run in basketball.

Yeah, BYU (Latter Day Saints) is private too, but is such a large institution, they came much closer to fitting the mold.

The concern with adding a Gonzaga would be:
What happens if the BB coach moves on, their basketball program winds up in the toilet, what have you got ?
A private Catholic school that looks REALLY out of place in the MWC.

To me, this is the same concern that has kept the PAC and Big XII from embracing Boise St. -
a school in a rather small media market with an outstanding FB team (what wil becaome of them with Chris Peterson gone ?)

If the MWC decided they wanted another school without FB to balance out Hawaii,
I would expect them to look to the WAC or Big West and go after a public school in a fair-sized media market that the MWC currently doesn't cover.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:47 am 
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Spending half my time in WY, I have followed the MWC for years. Once a tough, promising conference, they have been wounded by the loss of Utah, BYU, TCU and the diminishing strength of Boise St. The Mountain cable channel folded. Now the MWC is simply a weakened mirror of the AAC and CUSA, albeit with better scenery.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:07 pm 
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I'd say they are a mirror of the American (AAC), but both MWC and AAC are a step up from CUSA.
They represent the 2nd tier of FBS - below the "Power 5", but above CUSA and MAC, who are both above the Sun-Belt.

And the pendulum swings from year to year.... some teams are up while others are down... then wait 5 years.
Boise wasn't so dominant this year, but Fresno St. was very good.

Some teams get into a pattern (like Penn State did for a while) where the team peaks every 4 years or so.
This can happen when the core of the team comes in together, and then graduates al together.
the mark of a strong programs is how htey perform over a long time horizon....


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:09 pm 
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westwolf wrote:
Spending half my time in WY, I have followed the MWC for years. Once a tough, promising conference, they have been wounded by the loss of Utah, BYU, TCU and the diminishing strength of Boise St. The Mountain cable channel folded. Now the MWC is simply a weakened mirror of the AAC and CUSA, albeit with better scenery.


Which is why it's important to add a quality institution.

Gonzaga....might not be a perfect fit...but, who is?
BTW, has Gonzaga had only one coach this whole time? If so...Damn. Who is it? Must be Sainted by now??

I can't ever figure out what direction those schools(mwc) wants to head? They were all in the WAC...then that wasn't cool...so everyone bolts to a conference with a different name...but, containing almost the same lineup. It's just hard to keep up with.

The only real problem with not adding a team....is....there are 4 schools that only sponsor 5 sports within the conference(not a huge problem but, easily fixable)...and one sponsors 6 sports.

In picking up...one non-fb school....they can hand pick a market, size of school, quality of all of the above...and so on. Something that could enhance everything that they are struggling to acquire.

Gonzaga is very similar to Baylor, TCU, SMU or Rice(without fb, of course)...in the Texas market. They are roughly the same size schools, with law schools, and fair support for most athletic teams. But, again....it doesn't have to be Gonzaga....I just thought they had much to offer....to a group that needs some more options to jump ahead of their competing conferences.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 5:01 pm 
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Here's my take on the Gonzaga situation: The bulldogs have proved that their basketball program can sustain success and their RPI would be a welcomed addition by the basketball minded schools in the league. The other thing adding Gonzaga does is it significantly weakens the quality of BYU's conference of convenience and potentially brings the Cougars to the negotiating table for full membership in the MWC--they may as well be full member again since they are playing as many as 5 MWC schools a season in football. To round things off at 14 they would just need to bring in UTSA or UTEP to complete the league. UTEP has ties to many of the members in the league and UTSA is a great up and coming program, either would be a decent pick up.


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