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PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:34 pm 
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ncaanopaawaa2000 wrote:
How about New Mexico State would re-join the Sun Belt for all-sports within at least 3-5+ years, starting with this upcoming season. Any conference realignment outcome to make impact? Just trying to jump the gun a bit, because either way, the Sun Belt needs to still find additional expansion candidates in case they lose a possible pair in UL-Lafayette and Arkansas State to C-USA in the very far future.

WAC already needs members w/ or w/o NMSU in the conf. If NMSU went to the SBC I guess NJIT would be in play for the WAC.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:38 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
ncaanopaawaa2000 wrote:
How about New Mexico State would re-join the Sun Belt for all-sports within at least 3-5+ years, starting with this upcoming season. Any conference realignment outcome to make impact? Just trying to jump the gun a bit, because either way, the Sun Belt needs to still find additional expansion candidates in case they lose a possible pair in UL-Lafayette and Arkansas State to C-USA in the very far future.

WAC already needs members w/ or w/o NMSU in the conf. If NMSU went to the SBC I guess NJIT would be in play for the WAC.


But why NJIT would be considered to be in the WAC, so it could turn into a newer Great West Conference? NJIT should be either the AmEast, the NEC or the MAAC.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:44 pm 
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ncaanopaawaa2000 wrote:
Fresno St. Alum wrote:
ncaanopaawaa2000 wrote:
How about New Mexico State would re-join the Sun Belt for all-sports within at least 3-5+ years, starting with this upcoming season. Any conference realignment outcome to make impact? Just trying to jump the gun a bit, because either way, the Sun Belt needs to still find additional expansion candidates in case they lose a possible pair in UL-Lafayette and Arkansas State to C-USA in the very far future.

WAC already needs members w/ or w/o NMSU in the conf. If NMSU went to the SBC I guess NJIT would be in play for the WAC.


But why NJIT would be considered to be in the WAC, so it could turn into a newer Great West Conference? NJIT should be either the AmEast, the NEC or the MAAC.


I know, they could say no, or say yes but have no exit fee if the AEC or NEC takes them. But it's the only school the WAC could get that would give them 7 counting members.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 7:05 pm 
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If NMSU joins the SBC, it will still be sending its teams halfway across the country in volleyball, women's soccer, baseball, softball, golf, and tennis. At least the WAC has some opponents in the Mountain Time Zone.

I also think Texas A&M-Corpus Christi may not be long for the Southland given the recent direction o the conference. The WAC is really the only place the Islanders can go.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2014 8:46 pm 
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wbyeager wrote:
If NMSU joins the SBC, it will still be sending its teams halfway across the country in volleyball, women's soccer, baseball, softball, golf, and tennis. At least the WAC has some opponents in the Mountain Time Zone.

NMSU is right near El Paso, TX.
Seattle and CSUB aren't that close.
Neither are UTRGV, UMKC, and Chi St.
So really the only close (in terms of flight time) schools to them are Utah Valley and Grande Canyon.
On top of that the WAC offer virtually no travel partners (unless you count GCU/CSUB and UMKC/Chi St as travel partners.
And finally, everyone (except maybe GCU) is trying to leave the WAC for a more regional conference. Like ncaawhateverdude said, it's basically become the Great West 2.0 and if 1 school leaves, they'll be adding NJIT to the conference thus completing the coast to coast/lakes to gulf conference.

Looking at the SBC...
TX St, UTA, ULL, ULM, Ark St, and UALR are all reasonable for travel.

Yes, Troy/USA, GSU/GSU & App St/? are a bit of trip but with the travel partners help that out a bit.
wbyeager wrote:
I also think Texas A&M-Corpus Christi may not be long for the Southland given the recent direction o the conference. The WAC is really the only place the Islanders can go.
The Southland just added NOLA and added/lost Oral Roberts, and took a flier last year on UTPA/UTRGV.

TAMUCC isn't leaving the SLC, and the SLC isn't kicking them out (as they like being associated with an A&M system school) and I think the SLC may even double down on non fb schools like UTRGV (similar to TAMUCC, they likely want to associate with a UT system school) and possibly a D2 upgrade like Dallas Baptist (due to their baseball success and the fact that they don't have a school in DFW since losing UTA).

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 6:53 am 
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As tkalmus said: New Mexico St. is near El Paso, TX, right at UTEP territory, not on most of the Pacific Time Zone. Besides, the Aggies were used to compete most of the Sun Belt members during their first stint within the conference (current members UL-Monroe (football-only), UL-Lafayette, Arkansas St., UALR, South Alabama; and former members Louisiana Tech, North Texas, Middle Tennessee St., FIU, New Orleans, Denver). In other words, they would be familiar with the Sun Belt as a full member.

The Southland would only re-add UTPA (but soon to be UTRGV) if only a few schools of that conference go plan to jump to FBS to either C-USA or the Sun Belt. Texas A&M-Corpus Christi would stay on the Southland to be travel partner for UTPA. And I believe that it should be time for Dallas Baptist to upgrade to D-I from D-II and possibly be a full member of the Southland, especially for their baseball program's recent elite success. Plus, in terms of marketing, Dallas Baptist would be a great replacement for the Greater Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington metropolis. Plus, the Patriots are a non-football school, as much as UTA was.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:24 am 
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So if Umass for Football only and NMSU for all sports happens then what is the breakdown between the East and West division going to be. I get Fb is (Umass, App. St., GSU, GS, South AL, and Troy) and West would be (NMSU, Idaho, Tex. St., ULL, ULM, and Ark. St.) but how would the basketball breakdown? Which western team would move into the eastern division. Some are saying ULM would, but it looks like ULL is closer to Mobile (where South AL, is). App St. travel partner would have to be GSU it is the closest (less than 5 hours). GS is close to Troy AL, and South AL, is close to ULL. What do other's think?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:32 am 
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hibbett2222 wrote:
So if Umass for Football only and NMSU for all sports happens then what is the breakdown between the East and West division going to be. I get Fb is (Umass, App. St., GSU, GS, South AL, and Troy) and West would be (NMSU, Idaho, Tex. St., ULL, ULM, and Ark. St.) but how would the basketball breakdown? Which western team would move into the eastern division. Some are saying ULM would, but it looks like ULL is closer to Mobile (where South AL, is). App St. travel partner would have to be GSU it is the closest (less than 5 hours). GS is close to Troy AL, and South AL, is close to ULL. What do other's think?


Good point Hibbett. For the football perspective, it would be the following as you stated:

Sun Belt East: Appalachian St., Georgia St., Georgia Southern, South Alabama, Troy; UMass (fb-only)
Sun Belt West: Arkansas St., UL-Lafayette, UL-Monroe, Texas St.; New Mexico St. (all-sports?); UMass (fb-only)

But for the basketball breakdown, and if no other aspiring candidate hopefuls are discussed yet, some might think about Arkansas St. to the East or UALR (just to balance the divisions with one non-football school each, with UTA in the West).

Sun Belt East: Appalachian St., Georgia St., Georgia Southern, South Alabama, Troy; UALR (non-fb)
Sun Belt West: Arkansas St., UL-Lafayette, UL-Monroe, Texas St.; New Mexico St. (all-sports?); UT-Arlington (non-fb)

But what would happen if UTA or UALR (or both) add football (not saying that it'll happen), would it make or break the outcome of division realignment play within the conference?

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:26 am 
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So i was just reading on the NBC sports blog about maybe the FBS football ad for the SBC might be Army instead of Umass. (Idk if there is any truth to it or not) but the arguement is that the reason the AAC agreed to make a new bowl with the SBC (Cure Bowl) might be to give Army a chance to play Navy in a bowl game. interesting, like i said IDK but give something to talk about. So if SBC did have the option to add either Umass or Army for FB only, which would be the better fit for the conference?


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 10:54 am 
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hibbett2222 wrote:
So i was just reading on the NBC sports blog about maybe the FBS football ad for the SBC might be Army instead of Umass. (Idk if there is any truth to it or not) but the arguement is that the reason the AAC agreed to make a new bowl with the SBC (Cure Bowl) might be to give Army a chance to play Navy in a bowl game. interesting, like i said IDK but give something to talk about. So if SBC did have the option to add either Umass or Army for FB only, which would be the better fit for the conference?


At the risk of sounding ridiculous, Army is closer to the Sun Belt members than Massachusetts. Army offers a national brand name that every recognizes with a much deeper and richer football history than most schools in FBS. Adding Army may help the Sun Belt in scheduling non-conference games with the American since Army/Navy would be a consistent game year-in-year-out. I only have 2 reservations with Army. 1) Scheduling - since they will have to play both Navy and Air Force outside of conference play, they wouldn't have much spare games for anyone else & 2) MAC - okay its not really a reservation as much as it's a personal preference to see them in the MAC.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 2:32 pm 
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hibbett2222 wrote:
So if Umass for Football only and NMSU for all sports happens then what is the breakdown between the East and West division going to be. I get Fb is (Umass, App. St., GSU, GS, South AL, and Troy) and West would be (NMSU, Idaho, Tex. St., ULL, ULM, and Ark. St.) but how would the basketball breakdown? Which western team would move into the eastern division. Some are saying ULM would, but it looks like ULL is closer to Mobile (where South AL, is). App St. travel partner would have to be GSU it is the closest (less than 5 hours). GS is close to Troy AL, and South AL, is close to ULL. What do other's think?

You don't have to have div. for basketball, they also don't have to add NMSU for all sports, but yeah it does jack up the travel partners. If they don't add them for all sports I think UMass or Idaho's days are numbered in the SBC, and they'll add EKU or whoever from the east when they are ready.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 4:03 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
hibbett2222 wrote:
So if Umass for Football only and NMSU for all sports happens then what is the breakdown between the East and West division going to be. I get Fb is (Umass, App. St., GSU, GS, South AL, and Troy) and West would be (NMSU, Idaho, Tex. St., ULL, ULM, and Ark. St.) but how would the basketball breakdown? Which western team would move into the eastern division. Some are saying ULM would, but it looks like ULL is closer to Mobile (where South AL, is). App St. travel partner would have to be GSU it is the closest (less than 5 hours). GS is close to Troy AL, and South AL, is close to ULL. What do other's think?

You don't have to have div. for basketball, they also don't have to add NMSU for all sports, but yeah it does jack up the travel partners. If they don't add them for all sports I think UMass or Idaho's days are numbered in the SBC, and they'll add EKU or whoever from the east when they are ready.

While you don't need divisions for basketball, most simply play schools in their "division" twice (home and home) and the other schools just once (half home/half away).

I get that they could make it work, I just don't think they want to, they seemed pretty happy to add Idaho/NMSU as fb only offset for UALR and UTA (who they added basically just a month ahead of the fb onlys).

Personally I'm rooting for the SBC to add UMass and an Eastern bball school (UNCG, FGCU, Belmont) for now, that way when UMass/Idaho leave they can simply add Missouri St (or Lamar), EKU, NMSU all sports and another of the nonfb schools and get a nice 12/16 split.

West - NMSU, TX St, ULL, ULM, MO St + UTA & UALR
East - Troy, USA, GA St, GA So, App St, EKU + UNCG & FGCU (or Belmont)

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 4:16 pm 
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tkalmus wrote:
While you don't need divisions for basketball, most simply play schools in their "division" twice (home and home) and the other schools just once (half home/half away).

I get that they could make it work, I just don't think they want to, they seemed pretty happy to add Idaho/NMSU as fb only offset for UALR and UTA (who they added basically just a month ahead of the fb onlys).

Personally I'm rooting for the SBC to add UMass and an Eastern bball school (UNCG, FGCU, Belmont) for now, that way when UMass/Idaho leave they can simply add Missouri St (or Lamar), EKU, NMSU all sports and another of the nonfb schools and get a nice 12/16 split.

West - NMSU, TX St, ULL, ULM, MO St + UTA & UALR
East - Troy, USA, GA St, GA So, App St, EKU + UNCG & FGCU (or Belmont)


Lemme understand this. With your way of analyzing the Sun Belt, it would mean 12 football (with Mizzou St. (W)/E. Kentucky (E) in & Idaho (W)/UMass (E) out) and 16 basketball (with UALR & UTA (W)/2-team combo within UNCG/FGCU/Belmont (E)). Under that format style, it would be a stable conference with the max peak of 16 members and 75% of those members play football with a CCG; AND much better than the old Big East once EVER had between 2005-06 to 2011-12 with 16 members, but HALF were FBS football members. Plus, the old Big East never used division format for basketball since Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College left for the ACC, putting the old Big East from 14 to 11.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 5:37 pm 
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ncaanopaawaa2000 wrote:
tkalmus wrote:
While you don't need divisions for basketball, most simply play schools in their "division" twice (home and home) and the other schools just once (half home/half away).

I get that they could make it work, I just don't think they want to, they seemed pretty happy to add Idaho/NMSU as fb only offset for UALR and UTA (who they added basically just a month ahead of the fb onlys).

Personally I'm rooting for the SBC to add UMass and an Eastern bball school (UNCG, FGCU, Belmont) for now, that way when UMass/Idaho leave they can simply add Missouri St (or Lamar), EKU, NMSU all sports and another of the nonfb schools and get a nice 12/16 split.

West - NMSU, TX St, ULL, ULM, MO St + UTA & UALR
East - Troy, USA, GA St, GA So, App St, EKU + UNCG & FGCU (or Belmont)


Lemme understand this. With your way of analyzing the Sun Belt, it would mean 12 football (with Mizzou St. (W)/E. Kentucky (E) in & Idaho (W)/UMass (E) out) and 16 basketball (with UALR & UTA (W)/2-team combo within UNCG/FGCU/Belmont (E)). Under that format style, it would be a stable conference with the max peak of 16 members and 75% of those members play football with a CCG; AND much better than the old Big East once EVER had between 2005-06 to 2011-12 with 16 members, but HALF were FBS football members. Plus, the old Big East never used division format for basketball since Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College left for the ACC, putting the old Big East from 14 to 11.

Correct, and there are other options like Charleston which could also fill in nicely as a non-fb school in the East.

The Sun Belt added UTA (possibly out of pity since they just just to the WAC) primarily for their market and because they have considered adding football. The Sun Belt would add an Eastern bball school (with the possibility of a second) to balance out the numbers, for their market, and to improve their bball pedigree (Belmont, UNCG, Charleston and FGCU all provide that, and a school like FGCU could eventually add fb like UTA) ntm they all help fill in gaps in the Southeast.

The Sun Belt needs to excel in basketball too and by adding schools like NMSU, MO St, EKU, FGCU, and/or Charleston/UNCG/Belmont they would be in the neighborhood of the other Go5 conference. The goal of the Sun Belt should be to be competive with CUSA, MAC, MVC, WCC, and others to try and get at least 1 at large bid a year. They did it a year ago with WKU/MTSU but without some new bball blood its doubtful that they'll be able to do it again anytime soon.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 8:28 am 
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BePcr07 wrote:
hibbett2222 wrote:
So i was just reading on the NBC sports blog about maybe the FBS football ad for the SBC might be Army instead of Umass. (Idk if there is any truth to it or not) but the arguement is that the reason the AAC agreed to make a new bowl with the SBC (Cure Bowl) might be to give Army a chance to play Navy in a bowl game. interesting, like i said IDK but give something to talk about. So if SBC did have the option to add either Umass or Army for FB only, which would be the better fit for the conference?


At the risk of sounding ridiculous, Army is closer to the Sun Belt members than Massachusetts. Army offers a national brand name that every recognizes with a much deeper and richer football history than most schools in FBS. Adding Army may help the Sun Belt in scheduling non-conference games with the American since Army/Navy would be a consistent game year-in-year-out. I only have 2 reservations with Army. 1) Scheduling - since they will have to play both Navy and Air Force outside of conference play, they wouldn't have much spare games for anyone else & 2) MAC - okay its not really a reservation as much as it's a personal preference to see them in the MAC.


I've not heard any talk that Army is inclined to join a conference in football but their TV deal I think is about to expire and they've only secured bowl ties for three of the next six years. If you take a critical eye looking at their options, what you have is:

AAC. Basically the group Army couldn't compete with before in CUSA and even if AAC allowed Army and Navy to keep the financial windfall of their game's TV rights, the value falls because AAC cannot let them play after the title game because the game impacts the standings. The ratings for Army-Navy were falling and the second Saturday in December date pushed them back up to what they used to be. Moving to November would slash the TV value of the game.

MWC. Terrible geographic fit. At least has Air Force which helps their scheduling. But not likely to be competitive.

MAC. Could be very competitive with much of the league. May be viewed as a positive because part of the team's role is to promote enlistment, they do OK in the midwest but could do better.

CUSA. Could be very competitive with much of the league. South is historically a strong region for enlistment. Army games tend to attract generals and Congressmen and the south has lots of military friendly GOP congressmen. UTEP probably counts more west than south.

Sun Belt. Same as CUSA but also offers western exposure with Idaho and NMSU. If UMass were to come also, it would give Army a conference opponent they can bus to and lock in exposure in more regions.

Now I'm not expecting any Army announcements, until they say otherwise, I am assuming they are content as an indy.


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