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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:47 pm 
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I never thought of Coastal as a candidate for the SBC, but it would make sense them having the conversation about viability because they can't get the proper support for SoCon (or CAA). I know they need a new basketball arena...the one they have is a high school gym. I kind of think that's why they aren't getting the love from SoCon and others...facilities beyond football.

UTC as a serious candidate? I don't know about that...they were eying up OVC, which was filled with smaller TN system schools that would have made travel a lot easier. I think they could be happy enough in SoCon were it further raided, as I think SoCon could still swipe a few out of OVC.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 10:02 am 
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The Sunbelt should sign UMass to the same MAC contract for FB only and 4 BB games a year until they can justify a viable candidate for the 12th member for the Championship Game that Benson wants. By end of the 4 years the Sunbelt might find they like the NE exposure with UMass or UMass may finally land the AAC all sports bid they are hoping for to play teams like Temple, UConn, and Navy in their region of the country annually for FB. Its a win - win situation for both entities on a short term basis until college realignment sorts itself out again.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:40 pm 
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carolinaknights wrote:
The Sunbelt should sign UMass to the same MAC contract for FB only and 4 BB games a year until they can justify a viable candidate for the 12th member for the Championship Game that Benson wants. By end of the 4 years the Sunbelt might find they like the NE exposure with UMass or UMass may finally land the AAC all sports bid they are hoping for to play teams like Temple, UConn, and Navy in their region of the country annually for FB. Its a win - win situation for both entities on a short term basis until college realignment sorts itself out again.


This would be a good solution....IF, the conference hadn't gone against their earlier desires for a 12th fb member. But, unfortunately....they changed their minds...and no longer are looking for a 12th fb member.
Why did they chose to go this route.....I have no clue.
Seems like they just wasted a lot of effort and time going after the final member. Just to throw the plan out the window a few months later. To me....this whole expansion process that Benson attempted makes the SBC look very weak and hopeless. If they weren't going to 12 members...then why add Idaho? Idaho doesn't bring much of anything to the table especially when they only sponsor one sport in the conference. I also don't know if Georgia Southern was worthy of a bid at this time, if the conference wasn't going to get to 12.

It's my feeling that Benson is a moron. I hope that opinion of doesn't offend anyone except the person meant to be offended...Benson.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 3:54 pm 
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If the call-off of twelve is just to get JMU once and for all, I don't know if there's full vacancy in Benson's head. JMU runs a pretty sizable athletic department given their size. I don't know if JMU can "go back" on FCS if the divide between the FCS and FBS levels grows further apart. "Do or die" is on JMU, not the SBC...and maybe the SBC can wait them out, because until something else happens, "the last spot" is SBC's. So...what do you really want to do, James Madison?


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:41 pm 
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The Bishin Cutter wrote:
If the call-off of twelve is just to get JMU once and for all, I don't know if there's full vacancy in Benson's head. JMU runs a pretty sizable athletic department given their size. I don't know if JMU can "go back" on FCS if the divide between the FCS and FBS levels grows further apart. "Do or die" is on JMU, not the SBC...and maybe the SBC can wait them out, because until something else happens, "the last spot" is SBC's. So...what do you really want to do, James Madison?


Don't get me wrong....I like JMU, a lot. I just worry that JMU doesn't like the SBC, a lot.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2014 11:43 am 
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JMU would be a real geographic "outlier" in the Sun-Belt (with all those Texas, Louisiana, Arkansas, Alabama, Georgia schools.
Booneville, NC (Appy St) is the only school remotely close.

UMass is even much worse for the Sun-Belt.

HOWEVER, either of these schools (if they are serious about FBS) need a scheduling arrangement for football.

So either school might do well to offer to sign on as a football-only affiliate (JMU could stay in the CAA for Oly sports, UMass could stay in the A-10).
This would give them a football home, and the Sun-Belt could upgrade NMSU to full-member.

So Sun-Belt could have 10 all-sports members (including NMSU), 2 non-FB members (UALR and UTA), and 2 FB affiliates (Idaho and UMass / JMU).
That would seem to work for all concerned. I thought this was where the conf. was headed.
Maybe they are waiting for JMU to get a "reality check" where they come to the realization that "Beggars can't be choosers".


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 10:43 pm 
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Tute79,
That is a great plan. However, I think that the SBC is looking for an all-sports member. This is probably why the SBC did not add any school this spring. The possible NCAA rule change about not having to have 12 schools for a CCG is really concerning for me. This would give the SBC an excuse for not inviting another school to get to 12. I really think that the 12 team rule should stay for a CCG. I know that the Big 12 would LOVE for that rule to change, but I think that it is important as a reward for having 12 members.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2014 7:39 am 
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Don't think the new rule will pass. Conferences will still have to have at least 12 teams for a Championship Game.

Sunbelt has plenty of time another year or 2 to make up its mind for number 12.

UMass will play in the MAC this year and next year so an announcement for them will come after this FB season if James Madison rebuffs them again.

The Sunbelt does not want any more FCS move ups at this time and basically they can't agree on anyone in that group who wants to move up anyway.

UMass ends up with a MAC like deal for 4 years while the Sunbelt and UMass work on other viable options and New Mexico State is upgraded to all sports while Idaho remains on its 4 year contract with 2 year look ins. Their BB / Olympic sports remain in the Big Sky Conference.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:14 pm 
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Things are kind of coming to light regarding who the 12th member will be in the SBC. There are really only 4 options currently. If any other school leaves the conference then more options come into play but as it stands the choices are
1:) get UMass for FB only and invite NMSU for all sports
2:) Invite Liberty for all sports (who is really trying to get in SBC, and has great facilities just not much appeal).
3:) invite Missouri State for all sports (which has been leaked that SBC has spoken with MSU about invite).
4:) invite Eastern Kentucky for all sports (who are very interested and are improving facilities to make jump).
These are the 4 real options that I believe the SBC are considering (with a decision to be made either after FB season or before July 1st cut off).
Karl Benson really is pushing for a 12th school to have a CCG. SBC needs this or they will be the only Go5 conference without a CCG starting in 2015. If this happens then the SBC will be considered the odd man out with the selection committee for that one Big Bowl invite much like the Big 12 conference is being viewed by the P5 conferences for not having a CCG. The difference is that the SBC will not be able to play a 9 game Conference Schedule and get away with it like the Big 12 could.
Now if there is more expansion from other conferences and the SBC gets picked over again (which I don't really see happening again), even if the Big 12 expand (which is what would start the expansion process) I am fairly confident that BYU would be one of their top options, then you are looking at only one school from the AAC being taken most likely Cinny being taken. Then C-USA would more then likely lose one other school unless American went with UMass. If C-USA lost one then I believe that JMU would receive a invite over a SBC team.
So from a SBC perspective who would be the best option? (not who you like or don't like). UMass football only (which doesn't bring much to the conference other then they are FBS already so no transition needed). Liberty (who really wants to be in the SBC and would be a life long member because no other conference would invite them, but they do have the money and do have great facilities). Missouri State (who would be only the 2nd FBS school in the Show Me State) and thus could set up a MSU vs. UM every year, plus a large media market). Or EKU (who would replace WKU, and wants to be FBS, has received a large donation and is enlarging their football complex and seating).
What you think?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:34 pm 
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In thinking about Liberty and how they really want to be FBS. The current rules state that a conference must invite a school in order for that school to move up from FCS to FBS. Now I don't think that the SBC really wants to have Liberty long term due to the whole private school, religious/ whathaveyou issues. However their could be something worked out between Liberty and the SBC (possibly money in exchange for an FB only invite with a 2 year look in (like Idaho), where Liberty gets to transition to FBS, SBC gets to start a CCG while waiting for MSU or EKU or whomever to complete facility upgrades. After the two year transition SBC and Liberty could split ways, Liberty becomes independent (like BYU and ND, which they have said they want to be the Evangelical equivalent to ND). Then SBC can invite a school that fits more into their conference as all sports member.

What you think?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 7:02 pm 
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Hibbett,
I don't think that Liberty gets an invite - not enough votes. I see it this way - Missouri State comes in and they drop Idaho, also U.Mass invite FB only with all sports invite to New Mexico State. This way the footprint becomes more solidified in the west with U.Mass having a 2 year option like Idaho got. That way the SBC has another two years to look for an all sports invite in the eastern half of the conference. Also ALR drops for an all BB conf.
How does this grab you?


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:37 pm 
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The MAC kicked out UMass, it would look bad to invite them. UMass rents their stadium from the New England Patriots almost 100 miles from campus. Don't feel bad for them if they have to drop down to FCS or even drop football (ala Pacific University in 1997... and nearly Temple who just narrowly voted in favor of keeping football the same year).

I would just add Liberty for the off chance they turn into BYU East and routinely win the conference (often dominating against conference foes) and occasionally represent the Go5 on New Year's. No other candidate will try as hard or spend as much money as Liberty will to go undefeated and play the Big Boy's on New Year's Day.

Also, it was an insane waste of money to invite Idaho and New Mexico State. Likewise, insanity prevailed in hiring a commish from a deceased conference he oversaw the death of.

The Sun Belt needs to vote out their doofus commissioner yesterday. If I am a student athlete at Arkansas State, why the heck am I getting on a plane and flying across the county to play Idaho in front of ten fans for a conference game? It's one thing if Troy can't fill the stadium. It's quite another if you have to burn millions in fuel to play a game that very literally speaking less than two thousand people will witness INCLUDING people watching on TV.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:25 am 
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NorwichCat11 wrote:
Hibbett,
I don't think that Liberty gets an invite - not enough votes. I see it this way - Missouri State comes in and they drop Idaho, also U.Mass invite FB only with all sports invite to New Mexico State. This way the footprint becomes more solidified in the west with U.Mass having a 2 year option like Idaho got. That way the SBC has another two years to look for an all sports invite in the eastern half of the conference. Also ALR drops for an all BB conf.
How does this grab you?


I think that Missouri State would be a good option for the SBC in that it would allow the SBC to be in a larger market not a huge market but larger than a lot of the SBC schools. Also they would be only the 2nd FBS school in Missouri so that could set up a yearly meeting between MSU and Missouri (From the SEC). That would be huge for the SBC. They have the facilities it is just a matter of if they can afford the bump up. Any FCS school that moves up now must be willing to spend money. I just don't know if EKU or MSU can/ are willing to spend this money. It doesn't do the SBC any good just to add a school if the school is not going to spend the money to attempt to recruit against the top Go5 schools and lower P5 schools. I am not pushing for Liberty to get in, but they have the money to spend and are willing to spend it. From a conference standpoint you have to look at that. NMSU would be a good add for basketball but I feel that if the SBC wanted to do that they would have already done it. Same with the UMass invite. I don't see UMass getting a invite unless SBC has no other options and really wants the CCG. Idaho is a school that could stay in SBC for a while if no other school is willing to spend the money. I don't see SBC getting rid of UALR, or UTA. SBC would like UTA to start FB so that Texas St. would have a rivalry game every year in conference. I strongly feel that the 12th member will be either Missouri State (Top choice, if willing to spend the money) and Liberty (if Missouri State doesn't pony up).


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:03 am 
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Nothing will happen until the CUSA TV deal runs out then and the playoff deal is up for renegotiation, assuming the value of CUSA won't be much higher than the value of the SBC, I suspect you'll see some push from schools like Texas St, Arkansas St, ULL, and NMSU politicking to form a new regional conference ala the MAC. The timing would be difficult but I think at some point the Go5 conference not named the AAC/MWC are going to realize that flying from the Mid Atlantic to the Southeast to the Southwest isn't economically feasible unless your getting AAC/MWC money. The MAC has proved over the years that you can be successful in a regional conference and CUSA has proved that lot of markets does not equal success. Stay regional, spend the additional savings on coaches/facilities and focus on winning games and the ESPN contract will follow.

If there ever was a MWC style split with CUSA/SBC members, I'd suspect that it would be led by Texas St, who believe it or not, has more political capital than Rice, UTSA, and UTEP (only UNT has more) and if they could get support from a few key people I don't doubt this this could be a reality.

New Conference (?SWC?) - NMSU, UTEP, UTSA, TX St, Rice, UNT, Ark St, LA Tech, ULL
(9 leaves room for new members like Lamar, SHSU, SFA, or ULM, So Miss and possibly add UALR/UTA)

Every member brings value. CUSA members are obviously good, NMSU helps travel giving people a travel partner for UTEP, and ULL, Ark St, TX St (and GA St) are likely the best schools the SBC has to offer from a market/competitive standpoint and most likely be invited if the Big 12 raids the ACC who raids CUSA.

They could attempt to acquire So Miss, UAB, and GA St but that is likely a long shot as I think those schools would rather stay East than go West. But if it worked this new conference would clearly be a power player in from not only a competitive standpoint but also a market standpoint in the 2nd tier Go5 with representation in every Southern market from NM to GA not named Tennessee.

My best guess is that the rest of the conferences would shake out like this...

CUSA - So Miss, UAB, MTSU, WKU, GA St, FAU, FIU, UNCC, App St, ODU, JMU, Marshall

SBC aka "Upgrade City" - Idaho (fb only), Lamar, MO St, ULM, USA, Troy, GA So, EKU, Liberty, UMass (fb only)

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:15 pm 
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bigshotbob wrote:

I would just add Liberty for the off chance they turn into BYU East and routinely win the conference (often dominating against conference foes) and occasionally represent the Go5 on New Year's. No other candidate will try as hard or spend as much money as Liberty will to go undefeated and play the Big Boy's on New Year's Day.



I agree with everything you said except this part.

Liberty can't beat schools in the Big South. How is it...that they will be able to beat anyone above that level?
They have only had one or two quality seasons in the last 10 to 12 years. And they have scheduled a bunch of joke schools...which should be easy to rack up wins against.

Sure, they have some good facilities in fb. But, as some others have pointed out....so does Lamar....and we all know what their chances of getting called up are.

If Liberty started scheduling some quality OOC opponents, I would give them a break. But, it is very rare that they play anyone above the level of the Big South.

I don't think Liberty qualifies, yet.
Sam Houston has a much better record...and has played many DI powerhouses, as well as, the best DII schools over the same time period. Plus, Sam is pretty good in bb. Unfortunately, Sam hasn't fully updated their facilities, yet.


Your comments about the SBC commissioner....I totally agree. He is the death sentence for conferences. He totally wasted time and resources with his fruitless plans.....for both the WAC and SBC. He reminds me of UT's old Offensive Coordinator...under Mack.....I have tried to forget him...so his name escapes me now....but, thank God that dumb bastard is finally gone. His offenses were so fruitless.....screen left, screen right, delay draw trap, followed by some stupid reverse pass. And the offense only went backwards.
Better to get rid of them early.


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