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PostPosted: Tue Nov 16, 2010 10:22 am 
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Thanks wbyeager.

So UALR should be OK, until the Sun-Belt REQUIRES FB.

I'm wondering if they are "seeing the writing on the wall". The Summit Commish Tom Douple stated that he'd had some conversations with UALR. Maybe those conversations amounted to nothing, and Douple just wanted to act like he was doing his job.

The Sunbelt has been steadily trending toward a conference of all-sports members, though, and now UALR is the only school without FB. Once USA ramps up it's FB program, the league will have 10 + 1, and the other schools might think it appropriate to replace UALR with 2 new southeastern schools with FB (Lamar, Jacksonville State, Georgia State, Georgia Southern, Appalachian State, UNC-Charlotte).

If UALR needed to find a new home, the best fits might be:
MVC (not sure if they are interested in expanding beyond 10)
Summit (they might make a nice travel partner for Oral Roberts, the league could add UND and UNO (both also into MVFC football, and would need a 12th non-FB school)
Southland (but they seem to want FB for any expansion candidates).


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 10:21 am 
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tute79 wrote:
Thanks wbyeager.

So UALR should be OK, until the Sun-Belt REQUIRES FB.

I'm wondering if they are "seeing the writing on the wall". The Summit Commish Tom Douple stated that he'd had some conversations with UALR. Maybe those conversations amounted to nothing, and Douple just wanted to act like he was doing his job.

The Sunbelt has been steadily trending toward a conference of all-sports members, though, and now UALR is the only school without FB. Once USA ramps up it's FB program, the league will have 10 + 1, and the other schools might think it appropriate to replace UALR with 2 new southeastern schools with FB (Lamar, Jacksonville State, Georgia State, Georgia Southern, Appalachian State, UNC-Charlotte).

If UALR needed to find a new home, the best fits might be:
MVC (not sure if they are interested in expanding beyond 10)
Summit (they might make a nice travel partner for Oral Roberts, the league could add UND and UNO (both also into MVFC football, and would need a 12th non-FB school)
Southland (but they seem to want FB for any expansion candidates).


UALR seems like they'd be in a good spot if in the Southland. UCA nearby and other basketball schools close by. More importantly, they know the schools there are staying with only SHSU and Lamar seemingly with FBS hopes. If they left, so be it...the Southland would have options. Eventually, UALR wil (or has) asked themselves which conference is better for them.

As for the Sunbelt, I'd love to see Georgia St. and App St. join for two reasons:

1) If would make a nice tight conference:
East: FAU, FIA, Ga St., App St., WKU, MTSU
West: USA, Troy, ULL, ULM, Ark St, No.Texas

2) It would give the eastern schools a chance to improve themselves and adjust to FBS. In time, perhaps it opens the door for a new FBS conference with the remaining CUSA east schools (should some leave for the Big East) as well as other upgrades. Looking 10-15 years down the road:
Temple, Delaware, Marshall, JMU, ODU, ECU, App St., Charlotte, GA St., GA Southern,

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:37 pm 
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What attraction could the SunBelt have for App State? It would be a downgrade in football.

The Sunbelt is absolutely putrid. There is a real possibility that no team will have a winning record this year.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:06 pm 
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What attraction would UTSA and Texas St. have for the WAC who's leftovers minus Hawaii are worse than the Sun Belt.

Answer: being at the big boy table even if it's at the end. I'm not saying that App St. wants to go but that's the reason most do. Montana likes being the bully at the kids table so they stayed.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:50 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
What attraction would UTSA and Texas St. have for the WAC who's leftovers minus Hawaii are worse than the Sun Belt.

Answer: being at the big boy table even if it's at the end. I'm not saying that App St. wants to go but that's the reason most do. Montana likes being the bully at the kids table so they stayed.



UTSA was desperate, and Tx State didn't want to be left behind. App State doesn't have to settle for anything, just like Montana.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:18 pm 
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Quinn wrote:
Looking 10-15 years down the road:
Temple, Delaware, Marshall, JMU, ODU, ECU, App St., Charlotte, GA St., GA Southern,


I like the way you think, Quinn. Below posted Nov. 7 in Dream Conferences - for Fun thread. I first thought JMU instead of Ohio, but distance to Marshall influenced my final decision.

gsohokiefan wrote:
New I-A ("FBS") conference I'd like to see in 5-10 years:

Temple/Delaware (40 miles apart)
Marshall/Ohio U (80 miles)
Old Dominion/East Carolina (130 miles)
Appalachian State/Charlotte (100 miles)
Georgia State/Georgia Southern (210 miles)
Florida Atlantic/Florida International (45 miles)


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:27 pm 
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dbackjon wrote:
What attraction could the SunBelt have for App State? It would be a downgrade in football.

The Sunbelt is absolutely putrid. There is a real possibility that no team will have a winning record this year.


The pecking order goes FBS, FCS, D2, D3, NAIA. So if ANY schools goes from FCS to FBS, it's an upgrade. We get you're an FCs fan. That's great. My school participates at the FCS level as well. But it's not the highest level of football in college sports. And if any school wants to participate at the highest level, they have to take the first step. Based on membership numbers, the ideal home for APP St. in FBS, CUSA, is filled. So the Sunbelt is the only option. In time, perhaps they find success. Boise St, Nevada are just a couple examples of schools that upgraded and went to the lowest FBS conference (Big West), then upgraded to the WAC, and now are upgrading to the MWC. Even lowly Idaho upgraded from the Big West/Sunbelt to the WAC...it was the WAC that downgraded due to membership losses.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 17, 2010 9:51 pm 
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Quinn wrote:
dbackjon wrote:
What attraction could the SunBelt have for App State? It would be a downgrade in football.

The Sunbelt is absolutely putrid. There is a real possibility that no team will have a winning record this year.


The pecking order goes FBS, FCS, D2, D3, NAIA. So if ANY schools goes from FCS to FBS, it's an upgrade. We get you're an FCs fan. That's great. My school participates at the FCS level as well. But it's not the highest level of football in college sports. And if any school wants to participate at the highest level, they have to take the first step. Based on membership numbers, the ideal home for APP St. in FBS, CUSA, is filled. So the Sunbelt is the only option. In time, perhaps they find success. Boise St, Nevada are just a couple examples of schools that upgraded and went to the lowest FBS conference (Big West), then upgraded to the WAC, and now are upgrading to the MWC. Even lowly Idaho upgraded from the Big West/Sunbelt to the WAC...it was the WAC that downgraded due to membership losses.



that is assuming you think that FBS is the be-all end all for a school. If App State goes FBS, and Sunbelt, rest assured it would be only until something better came along. Not sure that would be the way for the Sunbelt to operate.

Many schools realize that until the economics of FBS football is changed, they are BETTER in FCS than a low-level FBS conference.


If any school FITS the Sunbelt, it would be Jacksonville State.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2010 1:34 am 
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Jacksonville St. wants in the SBC now, they just haven't got the invite. Commish Waters said they aren't looking to expand now. That was just before the Denver to the WAC move. I'll ask my guy if anything has changed or if they're happy w 10/11.

Of course App St. would join the SBC with the hope of getting into CUSA, If they are interested in moving up. It may never happen, but it's a goal if FBS is where they want to be.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 18, 2010 8:48 am 
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dbackjon wrote:
Quinn wrote:
dbackjon wrote:
What attraction could the SunBelt have for App State? It would be a downgrade in football.

The Sunbelt is absolutely putrid. There is a real possibility that no team will have a winning record this year.


The pecking order goes FBS, FCS, D2, D3, NAIA. So if ANY schools goes from FCS to FBS, it's an upgrade. We get you're an FCs fan. That's great. My school participates at the FCS level as well. But it's not the highest level of football in college sports. And if any school wants to participate at the highest level, they have to take the first step. Based on membership numbers, the ideal home for APP St. in FBS, CUSA, is filled. So the Sunbelt is the only option. In time, perhaps they find success. Boise St, Nevada are just a couple examples of schools that upgraded and went to the lowest FBS conference (Big West), then upgraded to the WAC, and now are upgrading to the MWC. Even lowly Idaho upgraded from the Big West/Sunbelt to the WAC...it was the WAC that downgraded due to membership losses.



that is assuming you think that FBS is the be-all end all for a school. If App State goes FBS, and Sunbelt, rest assured it would be only until something better came along. Not sure that would be the way for the Sunbelt to operate.

Many schools realize that until the economics of FBS football is changed, they are BETTER in FCS than a low-level FBS conference.


If any school FITS the Sunbelt, it would be Jacksonville State.



Jon, it has nothing to do with what I think, it's not a matter of opinions.

I personally think there should be no athletic scholarships in college sports unless said sport produces revenue. I personally think that my school should be non-scholarship football or be FBS.

But those are just opinions.

What is not an opinion is the tiered system that exists in college sports. At the top are Ohio St., Texas, USC, Florida, and most of the other schools in the top conferences. Not just football, but basketball too. You can count on a few fingers how many non FBS conference schools have made it to the NCAA Final four, just 1 hand for championship games they've played in and none have won a title.

A school that performs at the FCS level is not participating against the top level of competition. And regarding App St., just look at some of the schools in the SoCon.There's only (2) SoCon schools in the FCS Top 25, including App St. I'm sure App St. would do fine in the Sunbelt and potentially be a top program very fast. But if we're going to use opinions, I'll use one of my own: on the average year, a number of Sunbelt schools would rank higher than current SoCon schools for the average year.

But it all still comes back to the process in college sports: App St. would certainly have it's eyes on the Big East since it's an area BCS conference they could get into. But to get that invite, they'd need to work through the process just like every other school has: join a lower conference, find success, parlay it into a better invite. You've got all the examples like BSU and Nevada from Big Sky to Big West to WAC to MWC. Or TCU from WAC to CUSA to MWC...and maybe even the Big East. App st. or any other upgrade will need to go through that same pecking order.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 23, 2010 10:55 am 
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Article out of BlueRaider country with comments from SBC Commish about the future of the SBC.Although he does not appear to advocate future SBC expansion he does mention the possibility of replacing Denver with another school for 2012.Link at http://www.dnj.com/article/20101123/BLU ... lt+commish


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PostPosted: Fri Nov 26, 2010 8:43 pm 
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I think the Sunbelt could use at least 2 more schools maybe 4. With all these Bowl Games they are going to need more teams move up. Its what at 35 now with 2 more wanting approvals thats 74 teams how many more is needed?

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PostPosted: Sat Nov 27, 2010 3:06 pm 
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footballgod wrote:
I think the Sunbelt could use at least 2 more schools maybe 4. With all these Bowl Games they are going to need more teams move up. Its what at 35 now with 2 more wanting approvals thats 74 teams how many more is needed?


Hiya Fg!

I agree. The sunbelt might be near the bottom of the pecking order, but like the MAC, it's a conference that makes sense. It's never going to be at the top, but it is a tight footprint and rivalries develop...given time. If things with the WAC dont' work out, I think UTSA and Texas St. would be perfect. Could have nice (6) team divisions and wait for it...actually use regions like the SEC does. No. Texas, UTSA, Texas St., Arkansas St., ULL and ULM in the west with FIU, FAU, USA, Troy, WKU, MTSU in the east.


In time though, these are the conferences just hoping for a playoff. But they'd need an 18 team format with at least 4 of the schools in a play-in game. No way you give the MAC, SB, CUSA, and WAC autobids in a 12 or even 16 team playoff. It would mean top 10 schools in the country being left out for potential 5 loss schools.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:16 pm 
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I agree that Georgia State and APP State would be good adds but are they ready to join? Hard to get a read on that.

I think the Sun Belt would be smart to add Jacksonville State today, but think they like the WAC owning that FCS upgrade conference label.

That being the case a decent argument could be made to add I-AAA North Florida to restore the conference to 12. Heck maybe they could cut a deal with Charlotte to solve the 49ers' football problem. Then they still aren't adding an FCS school.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:48 am 
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finiteman wrote:
I agree that Georgia State and APP State would be good adds but are they ready to join? Hard to get a read on that.

I think the Sun Belt would be smart to add Jacksonville State today, but think they like the WAC owning that FCS upgrade conference label.

That being the case a decent argument could be made to add I-AAA North Florida to restore the conference to 12. Heck maybe they could cut a deal with Charlotte to solve the 49ers' football problem. Then they still aren't adding an FCS school.



Figure that with instability due to potential future defections, the WAC will likely be a big tent, welcoming of all. Charlotte will be looking for an FBS conference in about 5 years too. They can likely join the WAC as football #8 or #9 and remain in the A10 for other sports. Same holds with Jax St., Geography means less when we're talking football only. And it gives the other conferences like SB and Cusa time to let schools prove themselves first in FBS before inviting.

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