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PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 7:55 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
Mozilla--I'm a little confused about your analysis of "real opponents". I really don't think the number of rent-a-victim games an FCS program plays has anything to do with what kind of quality program a school is. I think what is more telling about a programs' ability to rise up and have success at the FBS level is their number of wins, conference titles, media market, and facilities. EKU's attendance numbers are no where near that of the minimum standard for FBS. I think EKU's flirtation with the SBC is very similar to the way ECU courted the Big East--EKU does not bring what the SBC really needs. There is no reason for the SBC to add a program simply to be a placeholder. They are better off waiting until a an FCS program that meets their criteria rather than impulse buying an EKU program they are only lukewarm about.


Sorry to be confusing. My analysis was quick....and if I recognized an opponent of one of these teams(to be a major)...I recorded it. Some teams didn't play more than one upper division school in 10 years. Others played at least one a year, every year...and sometimes more. So, I noted it...and called it a 'real opponent'. I was surprised that some schools NEVER played upper division schools.

I feel that scheduling tougher opponents is a good sign for a program.
Also, ...some teams are in very weak conferences....so, I don't really see that winning a five team conference like the Big South...really is much of an accomplishment.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:27 am 
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So the Sun Belt Insider has posted that JMU and EKU are the leading schools to be added to the Sun Belt. The article does go one to mention some other suchs that are being considered, but it appears that EKU has emerged as the 2nd choice for the SBC if JMU doesn't given an answer by January 2014. I think that if JMU decides to wait or is not willing to accept an invite in January 2014 then the SBC will send an invite to EKU. EKU makes since as far as what the SBC is looking for. It is a eastern school, and much closer to App State then WKU would have been. EKU's football stadium can sit 20,000. Their basketball team is about middle of the road and if they were to be added to the SBC and a eastern division was developled, EKU would be in the division with App State, Georgia State, Georgia Southern, South Alabama, and Troy. All the schools listed with the exception of Troy are recent movers from FCS to FBS. So i think that EKU could finish middle of the pack in this division in maybe their first or 2nd year. EKU coming in would already be better the Georgia State, and South Alabama and Troy are only 6-6 teams this year. App State and Georgia Southern would be transitioning as well and would take a few years to become consistant! I think EKU fits what SBC needs. A eastern school that wants to join the SBC, unlike JMU who is holding out for C-USA. The Sun Belt Insider did mention that it would be great to see if the SBC could get UAB to join back, but i don't really seeing this happening, since the conference they are in has more bowl tie-ins then the SBC does.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 1:56 pm 
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hibbett2222 wrote:
So the Sun Belt Insider has posted that JMU and EKU are the leading schools to be added to the Sun Belt. The article does go one to mention some other suchs that are being considered, but it appears that EKU has emerged as the 2nd choice for the SBC if JMU doesn't given an answer by January 2014. I think that if JMU decides to wait or is not willing to accept an invite in January 2014 then the SBC will send an invite to EKU. EKU makes since as far as what the SBC is looking for. It is a eastern school, and much closer to App State then WKU would have been. EKU's football stadium can sit 20,000. Their basketball team is about middle of the road and if they were to be added to the SBC and a eastern division was developled, EKU would be in the division with App State, Georgia State, Georgia Southern, South Alabama, and Troy. All the schools listed with the exception of Troy are recent movers from FCS to FBS. So i think that EKU could finish middle of the pack in this division in maybe their first or 2nd year. EKU coming in would already be better the Georgia State, and South Alabama and Troy are only 6-6 teams this year. App State and Georgia Southern would be transitioning as well and would take a few years to become consistant! I think EKU fits what SBC needs. A eastern school that wants to join the SBC, unlike JMU who is holding out for C-USA. The Sun Belt Insider did mention that it would be great to see if the SBC could get UAB to join back, but i don't really seeing this happening, since the conference they are in has more bowl tie-ins then the SBC does.


I have serious doubts as to the accuracy of his claim to be an insider.

The SBC needs more than just one school. They need 'numbers' to fight off constantly being on the edge of dissolving or losing their CCG.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:23 pm 
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mozilla wrote:
hibbett2222 wrote:
So the Sun Belt Insider has posted that JMU and EKU are the leading schools to be added to the Sun Belt. The article does go one to mention some other suchs that are being considered, but it appears that EKU has emerged as the 2nd choice for the SBC if JMU doesn't given an answer by January 2014. I think that if JMU decides to wait or is not willing to accept an invite in January 2014 then the SBC will send an invite to EKU. EKU makes since as far as what the SBC is looking for. It is a eastern school, and much closer to App State then WKU would have been. EKU's football stadium can sit 20,000. Their basketball team is about middle of the road and if they were to be added to the SBC and a eastern division was developled, EKU would be in the division with App State, Georgia State, Georgia Southern, South Alabama, and Troy. All the schools listed with the exception of Troy are recent movers from FCS to FBS. So i think that EKU could finish middle of the pack in this division in maybe their first or 2nd year. EKU coming in would already be better the Georgia State, and South Alabama and Troy are only 6-6 teams this year. App State and Georgia Southern would be transitioning as well and would take a few years to become consistant! I think EKU fits what SBC needs. A eastern school that wants to join the SBC, unlike JMU who is holding out for C-USA. The Sun Belt Insider did mention that it would be great to see if the SBC could get UAB to join back, but i don't really seeing this happening, since the conference they are in has more bowl tie-ins then the SBC does.


I have serious doubts as to the accuracy of his claim to be an insider.

The SBC needs more than just one school. They need 'numbers' to fight off constantly being on the edge of dissolving or losing their CCG.


I agree with you, i also think the SBC needs more than just one more school, and i think that they will be looking at adding mulitple school in the future, but i think that getting to 12 football playing schools is the driving factor. This is because with the new playoff system and how the top GO5 team will get a spot in one of the big bowl games. I think that the SBC has to act and act quickly to get a CCG ASAP! Money drives college football and getting more TV time is one way to add money. Adding a CCG gets more TV time which in effect adds more money!


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:18 pm 
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I do worry a bit about EKU's ability to get fan support in a state that is basketball crazy. Being close to Lexington will help...but really, how much does it help UK's fb?
I believe Louisiana and Texas are the best bets for support and quality of recruiting. Fan support and recruiting will help every school in the SBC.

If ULL and Ark State get pulled up to a different conference....it would help to have more schools from the central south to keep the conference footprint together. I keep thinking Sam Houston and McNeese State should be the first two on the list. There are a boat load of great recruits coming out of that region every year. And these two teams are regularly in the FCS playoffs.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:34 pm 
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mozilla wrote:
I do worry a bit about EKU's ability to get fan support in a state that is basketball crazy. Being close to Lexington will help...but really, how much does it help UK's fb?
I believe Louisiana and Texas are the best bets for support and quality of recruiting. Fan support and recruiting will help every school in the SBC.

If ULL and Ark State get pulled up to a different conference....it would help to have more schools from the central south to keep the conference footprint together. I keep thinking Sam Houston and McNeese State should be the first two on the list. There are a boat load of great recruits coming out of that region every year. And these two teams are regularly in the FCS playoffs.

IF ULL and ArkSt get a CUSA invite there are plenty of options for the SBC including SHSU, SFA, Lamar, Missouri St, and maybe a Louisiana school (though their funding situation is not exactly beneficial to them raising the cost of athletics).

There is also the possibility of UTA adding fb and then turning around a just grabbing NMSU as a full member.

And we might not want to rule out NDSU as a fb only member.

But the moral of the story is that it'll be relatively easy to find a Western member, despite all of the troubles in the East.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 1:35 am 
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EKU going to the SBC would be great news for UNA who wants to move to D-I and join the OVC. They already thought them and NKU were getting an invite last year but OVC decided not to expand.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:34 pm 
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EKU to the Sun-Belt sort of "came out of thin air", IMHO.

Might this be one of those "internet rumors" started by a wishful-thinking EKU alum / student ?


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:45 pm 
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I wonder if Karl Benson and the Sunbelt are just using EKU's interest in FBS as leverage on JMU and other more favorable expansion targets? They don't fit either model for successful FCS to FBS transition (those models being perennial FCS power or a start up program in a major city)


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 10:56 am 
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fighting muskie wrote:
I wonder if Karl Benson and the Sunbelt are just using EKU's interest in FBS as leverage on JMU and other more favorable expansion targets? They don't fit either model for successful FCS to FBS transition (those models being perennial FCS power or a start up program in a major city)


Well i guess if it works then Mr. Benson will look very smart! But i don't really see it as leverage, i see it as more of an enticement. We know that JMU wants to be in a conference that has more schools that are closer to them. We also know that SBC needs more than just one school so they are prepared when the next mass exodus happens (which it will!). If the SBC could get EKU to join then maybe they could entice JMU to join as well as accept Liberty (I know people don't like the Liberty thing, but listen). If EKU and Liberty were to join then JMU would have three schools EKU, Liberty and App State all within a 5 hour drive of each other. This would then be more appealing travel wise to JMU (who is really the school that Benson wants). Also i am not against Liberty joining. People that are against it, are against it only because they are a private Christian school and people think they will try and promote their beliefs on other members. To me this is crazy, it is no different then BYU or ND (which are also private Mormon and Catholic schools). Liberty has the facilties and are in a larger TV market and have their own TV network which is sometimes aired on MASN TV. I saw the game on MASN this week on the LSTN. So that right their is reason enough to bring them in. But if SBC could get these three schools then they could accept NMSU as full member and add NDSU as football only to make up the difference in the western division. They still might need one more school in the west but there are plenty of good options there, SHSU for example or Jacksonville State.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 12:16 am 
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hibbett2222 wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
I wonder if Karl Benson and the Sunbelt are just using EKU's interest in FBS as leverage on JMU and other more favorable expansion targets? They don't fit either model for successful FCS to FBS transition (those models being perennial FCS power or a start up program in a major city)


Well i guess if it works then Mr. Benson will look very smart! But i don't really see it as leverage, i see it as more of an enticement. We know that JMU wants to be in a conference that has more schools that are closer to them. We also know that SBC needs more than just one school so they are prepared when the next mass exodus happens (which it will!). If the SBC could get EKU to join then maybe they could entice JMU to join as well as accept Liberty (I know people don't like the Liberty thing, but listen). If EKU and Liberty were to join then JMU would have three schools EKU, Liberty and App State all within a 5 hour drive of each other. This would then be more appealing travel wise to JMU (who is really the school that Benson wants). Also i am not against Liberty joining. People that are against it, are against it only because they are a private Christian school and people think they will try and promote their beliefs on other members. To me this is crazy, it is no different then BYU or ND (which are also private Mormon and Catholic schools). Liberty has the facilties and are in a larger TV market and have their own TV network which is sometimes aired on MASN TV. I saw the game on MASN this week on the LSTN. So that right their is reason enough to bring them in. But if SBC could get these three schools then they could accept NMSU as full member and add NDSU as football only to make up the difference in the western division. They still might need one more school in the west but there are plenty of good options there, SHSU for example or Jacksonville State.


Travel partners for JMU should not be EKU and Liberty. If anything....Delaware and William&Mary would be much better. JMU is already used to their rivalry with these two teams. And both carry a larger market and come from a much better conference. Personally, I don't think the SBC has a very good chance to land JMU. Which leaves no reason to force feed EKU on the conference ...if they(EKU) aren't ready for the 'step up' in all respects. Is EKU completely ready for the upgrade? I would put EKU about fourth or fifth on the list for the SBC to pick up.

Also, think of it this way....if the SBC asked JMU to pick a school to bring with them....who would they choose? Where do you believe Liberty and EKU would stand on JMU's list?

And, I don't have any issue with Liberty that doesn't stem from their horrible records in fb and bb...and the fact that they hardly ever play better competition than what's in the Big South. So, please don't paint every member of the board in some stereotype regarding religion.

I do agree that the SBC should prepare itself for another group of schools to leave.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 2:27 am 
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tute79 wrote:
EKU to the Sun-Belt sort of "came out of thin air", IMHO.

Might this be one of those "internet rumors" started by a wishful-thinking EKU alum / student ?


You got any solid/more solid leads about D-I expansion anywhere than this? If not this at least gives us something to talk about until one of us debunks it. You and I could talk about D-II moves all the time but it won't get much traffic/input b/c we are 2 of the few who care and may be the only 2 w/ notebooks of all the Conferences and schools. TK also does but his is a high tech(compared to our notebooks) google account thingy.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:08 am 
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mozilla wrote:
Travel partners for JMU should not be EKU and Liberty. If anything....Delaware and Towson would be much better....

FIFY

W&M aint going FBS, Patriot or bust for them.

Towson would consider moving if UDel upgraded.

But yes, those 2 are significantly better than Liberty and EKU.

Fresno St. Alum wrote:
You got any solid/more solid leads about D-I expansion anywhere than this? If not this at least gives us something to talk about until one of us debunks it. You and I could talk about D-II moves all the time but it won't get much traffic/input b/c we are 2 of the few who care and may be the only 2 w/ notebooks of all the Conferences and schools. TK also does but his is a high tech(compared to our notebooks) google account thingy.


Yes, spreadsheets are sooooooo high tech. lol come on you old timers.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:25 pm 
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tkalmus wrote:
mozilla wrote:
Travel partners for JMU should not be EKU and Liberty. If anything....Delaware and Towson would be much better....

FIFY

W&M aint going FBS, Patriot or bust for them.

Towson would consider moving if UDel upgraded.

But yes, those 2 are significantly better than Liberty and EKU.

Fresno St. Alum wrote:
You got any solid/more solid leads about D-I expansion anywhere than this? If not this at least gives us something to talk about until one of us debunks it. You and I could talk about D-II moves all the time but it won't get much traffic/input b/c we are 2 of the few who care and may be the only 2 w/ notebooks of all the Conferences and schools. TK also does but his is a high tech(compared to our notebooks) google account thingy.


Yes, spreadsheets are sooooooo high tech. lol come on you old timers.


I didn't add Towson because I thought I remembered reading that they were cutting their athletic budget quite significantly.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 6:59 pm 
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mozilla wrote:
I didn't add Towson because I thought I remembered reading that they were cutting their athletic budget quite significantly.

That might be true (too lazy to look it up) but I remember they at least looked into the possibility of FBS, I don't think W&M has ever even looked.

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