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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:26 am 
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The BE football is rated better than the ACC.

The BE has tremendous tv markets.

espn spin has for over a decade trying to destroy the BE.

currently mwc teams are both in the PAC12 and Big 12.

Former BE schools make up a large % of the acc.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:39 am 
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In all honesty, with ESPNs current investments in the Big Ten, ACC, SEC, and to a lesser extent the Pac 12 and Big 12 now that those conferences have divided their coverage between the Evil Empire and FOX, the Big East is really looking at Thursday and/or Friday night time slots and maybe an occasional game on ESPNU and the rest will be warehoused on ESPN3.com. If Aresco wants his conference to have visibility and exposure he almost has to go with another network. May be he can work out a deal with ESPN for 1 game a week but I think the bulk of the contract has to be with someone who is looking for football inventory and will give the Big East air time.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 2:57 pm 
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Looking at Rutgers, Louisville, and Cincy, these are very good and ranked fb programs this year. Like so far this year undefeated Mississippi State of the SEC, perhaps some under-ranking and under-noticed activity is going on.

The BE hopes to market nation-wide appeal with their new collection. I believe the expansion initiative with the BE was to look as "BCS" as possible, at least to edge the big power conferences, and show the BE is a clear cut entity above the non-BCS types. With the demise of the BCS distinctions in favor of the new play-off and bowl arrangements, what the BE has been trying to do appears disjointed, and frankly, a bit desperate to maintain the more lofty status they once did by comparison.

The BE rejection of the prior offer may have something to do with the perception that ESPN is trying to diminish the BE. I tend to believe it was less about harming the BE, and more about supporting the ACC and B12 with their expansion efforts which enhances the value of the telecasting with those respective conferences.

Getting major bowl sponsorship for the BE is a challenge. The SEC and B1G can largely fill prominent bowl games with whomever they have. Big names, large fan bases, and regionalism sells. With the BE, it become much more acute as to who and where representation is derived.

I must say this in behalf of the BE. They show tenacity and survive when it could be predicted the structure would fall. Rather than abandon the hybrid, they double-downed on it. That may yield dismay for some based on prior turmoil, but the BE still sees it as survival.

What the BE can garner for TV may be under-valued. They are going to have pursue clever ways to enhance it. Such is limited. You made an important point, Fighting Muskie. Maybe they can pursue more Thursday night games, improved strategic scheduling in conference and OOC, use multiple network deals, etc. Finding an appealing #14 in fb may help a tad, but the conference's expectations may have to settle for "as good as it can be reasonably hoped for" reality, rather than "our distribution shall match those at or anywhere close to the top".


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:06 pm 
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It sure seems that the BE will cut espn spin away.

They will be replaced by either NBC or fox and a BE tv network.

Also the national championship 7th bowl will be enhanced by having a tv network behind it wants the BE to grow not to help kill it off.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:16 am 
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There are a lot of factors to consider when looking at the Big East. A big one is the overall level of competition. Another is the SOS. Another is the sie of the conference. And another is a huge flaw in the actual polling/ranking system.

The Big East for years was at 8 members while SEC, Big 12, CUSA, MAC were at 12. Big Ten was at 11, and you had the Pac-10 and the ACC. At only 8 members, the Big East has an easier overall path to what is deemed "success" for a school: no championship game, lower overall quality at the top of the conference. The Big East schools, for no reason of their own, would look to lesser conferences for OOC games, no different than the conferences above them. But if say the Big East is Tier 3, it means they are looking for OOC schools below them...which is a more limited pool than say the SEC, who as Tier 1, can look at a Tier 2 conference school for a less competitive scheduling idea.

And then there is the polling issue. The voters seem to put a premium on being undefeated. Even the BCS did...when they put in a clause that the top non-BCS conference school would get an at-large bid if the school was undefeated. A few years back, 2006, you had Rutgers and Louisville undefeated...while neither had played anyone tough all year...and both schools were ranked in the top 10.

So when you look right now at Louisville, Rutgers, and Cincy, does anyone think they are better teams than the majority of the 1 or 2 loss SEC, Big 12, ACC, Big Ten, Pac-12 schools whom these schools are all ranked higher than? It's arbitrary. But when we look at some schools like VA Tech and Miami who dominated when in the Big East, now that they are in the ACC, the dominance is gone. The ACC has been pretty balanced over the years with a number of schools winning the conference.

There might have been a debate in the past, but with the Big East losing 7 of it's top programs since 2003, with 5 of those joining the ACC, it's difficult to say that the Big East is better than the ACC when so much of the ACC membership is made of those former Big East schools.

I think the Big East did a good job in recovering recently, adding the best that they could, even adding FB only schools like Boise St. to bolster the quality. But a conference will always only be as good as the options it has in membership.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:44 am 
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A conference can be restricted by the anti-BE behavior of its tv contractor:
1.who pays it less by far than other conferences
2.helps in the raiding of its membership to ensure that the broadcasters power is not weakened
3.who consistently bad mouths the BE

Also are bc,pitt,syracuse really superior football programs to boise st,cfla,houston and smu?


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:42 am 
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Louisville blog article with comments from Louisville AD regarding various topics to include BE realignment at http://uoflcardgame.com/tom-jurich-roll ... sues/34295


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:04 am 
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ctx48c wrote:
A conference can be restricted by the anti-BE behavior of its tv contractor:
1.who pays it less by far than other conferences
2.helps in the raiding of its membership to ensure that the broadcasters power is not weakened
3.who consistently bad mouths the BE

Also are bc,pitt,syracuse really superior football programs to boise st,cfla,houston and smu?


Quite true. But ESPN stuck with the Big East after the big football departures of Miami and VA Tech, as well as BC. If they wanted out, they could have. They also kept the big money renewal offer on the table when they could have pulled it. It was the Big East that passed on it, thinking they could do better. Maybe they still can if there is enough competition n the bidding. So regardless fo what influence they had on ESPN (Pitt and Syracuse), the network did show support for the Big East.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:32 am 
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ctx48c wrote:
A conference can be restricted by the anti-BE behavior of its tv contractor:
1.who pays it less by far than other conferences
2.helps in the raiding of its membership to ensure that the broadcasters power is not weakened
3.who consistently bad mouths the BE

Also are bc,pitt,syracuse really superior football programs to boise st,cfla,houston and smu?


1) There isn't national inventory worth paying for on the football side. Sorry to break it to you, but South Florida doesn't play national games. Nor does Louisville. Or Cincy. Or Rutgers. That's the top of this conference in football...are we to pay them big bucks just because their Tier 2 stuff resides in good markets? That's not justification for a good television contract when football drives the bus. Sorry that you think basketball is what moves this whole thing. Big East basketball-only schools get paid more than enough for what they do. They contribute nothing for their football-subsidized earnings other than franchise their name.

2) Don't blame the ACC or Big XII for the Big East's terrible innards. Don't discount what guys like Calhoun, Luck, Boeheim, and Auriemma hinted at regarding the "issues" within. A non-contributor in ND made life HELL for some of these schools, and while ND got rich and fat, these other institutions stood without. And stop discounting where some of these schools publicly did before they left the conference: TCU for YEARS said they wanted to be in the Big XII (remember how much they hate(d) Baylor?). Miami was a notorious ACC name-dropper back in the 80's, even traveling with the friggin conference to Arizona for their meetings just to get noticed. Syracuse wanted out in the 90's. Pitt's been chasing the Big Ten for decades. Virginia politics saw the Big East as a waste for VPI. Notre Dame, not even five years into their relationship, almost joined the Big Ten, then went to talk to the ACC some time later.

Seriously, do some research. ESPN isn't free from blame, but the Big East is not symbol of innocence. Far from it.

3) If the shoe fits. For undeserving schools like USF to block equally undeserving ones like UCF, or Louisville doing it to Memphis (and still doing it to ECU and USM), UConn to UMass, Aresco calling Navy out...if the Big East was a chick, she would be a six. What this six is doing is pretty much putting down fives. To the ladies hanging out in 8+ land, it's indistinguishable. Trailer park trash catfights.

Believe me, the best parts of the conference are glad to be gone from the Big East. If they aren't mourning their decisions, you shouldn't be either.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:58 pm 
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Attendance figures through 7 weeks show the current BE average at 40,800. Subtracting Pitt and Syracuse and adding the new 7 (including Navy) would put the average for the NBE at 35,900. Big TV contract for those numbers? Hmmm.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 7:16 am 
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The Liberty Bowl's executive director name-dropped ECU as a potential 14th candidate.

Considering what the Liberty Bowl is about to be reduced to, I hope if the guy is just fishing his personal interests out there, the Big East listens. East Carolina travels...that can't be said for anyone in the Big East these days.

And if it is true that the conference is finally softening on the Pirates, I suppose Louisville is packing their bags.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 9:22 am 
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If ECU does receive a BE invite, the hope should be for all sports. ECU does have solid facilities for non-fb sports, and to diminish these sports for what may be an incremental step forward for fb, would not be much of a net gain as a comprehensive look of ECU's sports totality.
The geography argument, in itself, really should not be used against ECU bb-plus. While ECU wanted and needed closer, regular rivals; ECU see themselves as much more established and beyond ODU and UNCC (outside of just basketball).

ECU has vigorously tried to enter the BE for years, even conditionally. If accepted, ECU would have been the type of school that would have committed to the BE, knowing any other plausible options would have been less. ECU would be a long-term stay. Could the same be said of Boise State and SDSU fb?

Temple, Rutgers, Navy, UCONN, Cincy, UCF, and UCF would be close enough to offer reasonable fan travel opportunities for fb, and generally compatible competition.

As to BYU and/or AFA, the perplexity is visualizing if joining the BE for fb only would yield enough long-term monetary incentive and post-season opportunities for it to be plausible.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:45 pm 
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ECU for all sports would get them back to 18, easier to do 18 team schedule than 17.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 4:23 pm 
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sec03 wrote:
If ECU does receive a BE invite, the hope should be for all sports. ECU does have solid facilities for non-fb sports, and to diminish these sports for what may be an incremental step forward for fb, would not be much of a net gain as a comprehensive look of ECU's sports totality.
The geography argument, in itself, really should not be used against ECU bb-plus. While ECU wanted and needed closer, regular rivals; ECU see themselves as much more established and beyond ODU and UNCC (outside of just basketball).

ECU has vigorously tried to enter the BE for years, even conditionally. If accepted, ECU would have been the type of school that would have committed to the BE, knowing any other plausible options would have been less. ECU would be a long-term stay. Could the same be said of Boise State and SDSU fb?

Temple, Rutgers, Navy, UCONN, Cincy, UCF, and UCF would be close enough to offer reasonable fan travel opportunities for fb, and generally compatible competition.

As to BYU and/or AFA, the perplexity is visualizing if joining the BE for fb only would yield enough long-term monetary incentive and post-season opportunities for it to be plausible.


At this point, depending on what happens with the other 2 official CAA invites, CofC and App St., gotta think they'd be content in bringing ECU back if ECU needed a home for non-football sports. UNCW would be happy at least.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:47 pm 
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Bishin mentioned the Liberty Bowl... a lot of BE fans are now hanging their collective hats on rumors of FedEx to come through (with Memphis) to spur the networks to pay better for TV rights. I personally don't know what to make of the true possibility here.

I gotta tell ctx... this isn't Seattle. This is college football. People don't change their college affiliations at the drop of a hat. I've seen all sorts of evidence of the Big East having as good or better football teams as/than the ACC. However, you'd trade North Carolina for Louisville. Most won't. It's not just a matter of winning. It's SUSTAINING, and for longer than Boise already has, BTW.


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