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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2017 3:26 pm 
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Mesa Lejos wrote:
tute79 wrote:
ACC: Notre Dame FT football. Add WVU or ISU for 16.
(With ND, not too absurd since ISU is an AAU midwest school).

B1G: #15. Kansas. #16. Texas (prefered); or ISU (hard sell in deal).



ISU is not wanted by the richer conferences.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2017 5:54 pm 
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Yeah, no way do I see ACC accepting ISU.

I was probably thinking WVU or UConn to ACC.

If some agreement were struck where some P4 HAD to take ISU, maybe Big Ten, if they got some other great deal to compensate them (like Texas...)

I dunno, this is all idle speculation. Who knows what the landscape might look like in 2024...


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:27 am 
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If the B12 agreed to dissolve prior to the
expiration of their GoR/contracts on the basis
of an agreement to disburse members to
the other P5 conferences, ALL members
would have to be accommodated, including
Baylor, unless they were expelled beforehand.
Anyone excluded would have a strong lawsuit
against all parties to the agreement, or the
affected school(s) targeted for exclusiion
would have to be paid-off bigtime as part
of the agreement.

The most likely scenario is that nothing is
done prior to the 2023/24+ period. In the total
scheme of expansion deliberations, that is
not particularly a long time away. Timelines
and existing agreements of the other P5
conferences are also factors interplaying.

It is fun to draw-up placements, and officials
have probably speculated on potential
strategies and options, but there are too
many complexities and barriers to make
such work within the next six or seven years.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:52 am 
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If OU and Texas would rather join another conference and not "save" the Big XII (they may have already made this decision),
there may be some lobbying behind the scenes starting a year or two prior to 2024.

They would have to deny it, since such lobbying could be construed as undermining their current conference (Big XII).
But the big boys are going to want to control their own destiny, if P5 -> P4.

Those 2 schools have leverage as to where they end up. The others are more at the whims of the ACC, B1G, SEC, PAC.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2017 9:27 am 
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Rather than dissolve the big xii would just devolve into a G5 conference if it retains enough members
Wonder if they would then look to the Dakotas for new members


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2017 9:52 am 
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Huan wrote:
Rather than dissolve the big xii would just devolve into a G5 conference if it retains enough members
Wonder if they would then look to the Dakotas for new members


That might be possible. However, all 4 Dakota schools don't have the upgraded facility requirements yet in an FBS school standpoint; like 20k or 30k seats for football stadiums or 4k or 5k for basketball arenas. And if so, how about renaming the Big XII to the "new" North Central Athletic Conference?

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2017 11:03 am 
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Well -

Some of the Dakota schools (NDSU in particular) rank at the top of FCS, and have demonstrated they can hold their own vs. FBS...

HOWEVER, college football today is all about raking in TV money.

TO PUT IT MILDLY, the Dakotas don't quite "cut it" in terms of TV market....


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:11 pm 
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Mesa Lejos wrote:
If the B12 agreed to dissolve prior to the
expiration of their GoR/contracts on the basis
of an agreement to disburse members to
the other P5 conferences, ALL members
would have to be accommodated, including
Baylor, unless they were expelled beforehand.
Anyone excluded would have a strong lawsuit
against all parties to the agreement, or the
affected school(s) targeted for exclusiion
would have to be paid-off bigtime as part
of the agreement.

The most likely scenario is that nothing is
done prior to the 2023/24+ period. In the total
scheme of expansion deliberations, that is
not particularly a long time away. Timelines
and existing agreements of the other P5
conferences are also factors interplaying.

To alter or negate the Big 12 contract and its terms and conditions, it would require eight members concurring, not the full ten. However, it would have to be done in a way that is seen as not deliberately generating "undue damages" to schools in the minority. Much depends on the language of their charter document.
I seriously doubt a conspiracy could be pulled-off with the other P5 conferences. There are some B12 schools that would not interest any other prime conference. What may happen as 2023/24 approaches, one of more schools in the B12 would declare an exit date that would be effective during the "window" period. Such school(s) would already have worked out, at least informally, admission to another P5 conference.
The B12 could try to prevent such by re-negotiating the TV agreement terms early, and extending the G0R again well in advance of its expiration date. The ACC pursued something similar when, before the GoR, voted to have a 30 million(+) or so exit fee placed upon themselves. FSU and Maryland voted against it. Maryland challenged it, when soon thereafter, they declared their intent to move to the B1G. That led to messy litigation.
When the SEC took Texas A&M and Missouri, they both had to be systematically free to move before they were officially accepted to the conference.

P5 conferences are not going to expand unless they are convinced that by adding school X and school Y, they will be adding 3 to 5 million to the coffers of each existing conference member yearly. How many B12 schools may actually provide that? Two to four, depending on who the new host conference(s) will be. That's where the networks have power in influencing expansion.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 3:24 am 
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I see grounds for a "damages" lawsuit when a contract is broken.

When Maryland left the ACC, they had previously agreed to a GoR, and so litigation was required.
Maryland had to fork over money to escape the GoR and regain their TV rights.

In the case of the Big XII, if and when the GoR expires, the various Big XII schools no longer have any obligation to each other.
Well, not sure if there are still any exit fees, but a school can unilaterally choose to leave and cough up the exit fee.

So once the Big XII schools are no longer contractually bound to each other, they effectively become free agents.
And the other P4 can invite who they choose.

IF the remaining P4 were to get together and form agreements as to how to chop up the Big XII,
then any schools left out could possible charge them with collusion...


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 11:43 am 
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tute, you may want to double-
check that. The ACC enacted
the GOR after Maryland
announced they were leaving.
It was contention over the
enhanced exit fee and the ACC
withholding Maryland's share
of conference distribution.

No one has challenged a GoR
yet in college conference athletics.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:31 pm 
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Maybe you're right - so did the ACC hang them on a $50 mill exit fee ? The settlement was for something > $30 mill, wasn't it ?


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2017 1:23 pm 
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tute79 wrote:
Maybe you're right - so did the ACC hang them on a $50 mill exit fee ? The settlement was for something > $30 mill, wasn't it ?


Close - 34.1 million.

ACC was asking 52.2 million.

WVU settled with then, BE for 20 million.

Rutgers paid 11.5 to old BE in heading for B1G.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/co ... /13781545/


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 2:06 am 
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Should we never say never on Big 12 expansion? https://www.yahoo.com/sports/m/d101d884 ... rs-are.htm

This rumor could make sense as we are coming close to the end of the basketball season and every Big 12 AD and President will be in Kansas City for the men basketball tournament and most Big 12 officials will likewise be present at the NCAA men final four.

The last time the Presidents meet ended with the lack of getting the necessary majority of votes on which teams to invite. Maybe time has provided more thoughts on which teams would be preferred by all ten schools.

It would allow the Big 12 to provide plenty of notice to other leagues before the physical end of the year on July 1, 2017.

The men final four tournament would be a nice place to announce which team would finally make the cut should the league finally decide to expand. The homework has long sense been completed.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 9:01 pm 
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2017 9:03 pm 
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lash wrote:
Should we never say never on Big 12 expansion? https://www.yahoo.com/sports/m/d101d884 ... rs-are.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This rumor could make sense as we are coming close to the end of the basketball season and every Big 12 AD and President will be in Kansas City for the men basketball tournament and most Big 12 officials will likewise be present at the NCAA men final four.

The last time the Presidents meet ended with the lack of getting the necessary majority of votes on which teams to invite. Maybe time has provided more thoughts on which teams would be preferred by all ten schools.

It would allow the Big 12 to provide plenty of notice to other leagues before the physical end of the year on July 1, 2017.

The men final four tournament would be a nice place to announce which team would finally make the cut should the league finally decide to expand. The homework has long sense been completed.

I guess this football and basketball season adds another bullet point for each of the teams. Though I doubt much has changed from earlier to today to make teams more attractive. At this point would expansion even net the conference more money? One of the talking points last time around was the increased revenue. I think it was like 50 million a school I think. Did the conference agree to not expand and remove that part of the contract for a bump In money now?

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