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PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:56 am 
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I applaud UCF for their terrific season, and agree with Frost that the committee's ratings are rigged to exclude ANY G5 school from the CFP.

It's just so difficult for a G5 school to elevate itself to the P5 level and stay there for any length of time, since they lack P5 financial resources, and the people who make any such school very successful are immediately ripe to be cherry-picked by a P5 school, who can offer substantially more money to leave.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 3:26 pm 
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I congratulate UCF on their undefeated season...but, it needs to be taken with a few grains of salt.

They only played 1 P5 school...Maryland. And the schools that filled in the other spots had win/loss records of this:

FIU 8-5
Maryland 4-8
Memphis 10-3
Cincy 4-8
ECU 3-9
Navy 7-6
Austin Peay 8-4
SMU 7-6
UConn 3-9
Temple 7-6
USF 10-2

4 teams below .500
3 teams 1 game over .500
1 FCS team
3 teams with good records

I just don't see this as a National Championship season.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:18 am 
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The two teams playing in the national championship each have one loss. The team both lost to: Auburn.

UCF doesn't have any losses. The last team they beat: Auburn. I'm not saying UCF would beat either Georgia or Alabama. But how do you know they wouldn't win.
72% of the country said Auburn would beat UCF. All the talking heads predicted Auburn would win. They were wrong.

2013 94% of the country predicted Baylor. Most predicted it would be a blowout. They were wrong then too.

If anything has been proven over the last 35 years or so, never doubt them boys from Florida. We know a thing or two about football down here.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:56 pm 
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Article out of Fort Collins discussing how the 2016 Big 12 expansion candidates have fared since at https://www.coloradoan.com/story/sports ... 006929001/


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 05, 2018 7:25 pm 
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hendu1976fl wrote:
The two teams playing in the national championship each have one loss. The team both lost to: Auburn.

UCF doesn't have any losses. The last team they beat: Auburn. I'm not saying UCF would beat either Georgia or Alabama. But how do you know they wouldn't win.
72% of the country said Auburn would beat UCF. All the talking heads predicted Auburn would win. They were wrong.

2013 94% of the country predicted Baylor. Most predicted it would be a blowout. They were wrong then too.

If anything has been proven over the last 35 years or so, never doubt them boys from Florida. We know a thing or two about football down here.


If UCF played the strong schedule that Auburn played....how do you see their record at the end of the season?

Auburn played:

Georgia Southern 2-10
Clemson 12-2
Mercer 5-6
Missouri 7-6
Miss St 9-4
Ole Miss 6-6
LSU 9-4
Arkansas 4-8
aTm 7-6
Georgia 13-1
ULM 4-8
Alabama 12-1


If UCF played all these games...I have them at 5-7.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:23 pm 
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Big 12 commissioner on UCF: Playing in AAC not the same as playing in Power Five
https://www.cbssports.com/college-footb ... ower-five/


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:51 pm 
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Just an illustration of the prejudice against G5 schools.

I think we all agree the level of competition is better in the P5 conferences.
But it's wrong to immediately disqualify every non-P5 team right out of the gate, and that's what Bowlsby is doing.
Bowlsby is among those who will not even CONSIDER a G5 school for a slot in the CFP.

Theoretically, why can't one of the top 4 teams be a G5 team ?
The committee without a 2nd thought immediately ranks them way low, and ensures that a team like UCF
"is put in their place".

To break up this P5 cartel, the CFP needs to expand to 8 teams and at least one at-large should go to an undefeated G5 school.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:49 pm 
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CSNBBS MB thread speculating potential of Big 12 realignment:

Killing the BIG XII
http://csnbbs.com/thread-839807.html


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 11, 2018 11:48 pm 
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tute79 wrote:
Just an illustration of the prejudice against G5 schools.

I think we all agree the level of competition is better in the P5 conferences.
But it's wrong to immediately disqualify every non-P5 team right out of the gate, and that's what Bowlsby is doing.
Bowlsby is among those who will not even CONSIDER a G5 school for a slot in the CFP.

Theoretically, why can't one of the top 4 teams be a G5 team ?
The committee without a 2nd thought immediately ranks them way low, and ensures that a team like UCF
"is put in their place".

To break up this P5 cartel, the CFP needs to expand to 8 teams and at least one at-large should go to an undefeated G5 school.


Expanding to 8 teams isn't going to fix the problem you are trying to solve.

Go5 schools just don't play as tough a schedule as P5 schools. Why not just have a Go5 championship?

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:41 pm 
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This Florida politician insists the Big 12 add UCF and USF as a ‘package deal’
The Big 12’s not expanding now, but these two will be frequently discussed if it ever does.
https://www.sbnation.com/college-footba ... -expansion


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:39 pm 
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joeben69 wrote:
This Florida politician insists the Big 12 add UCF and USF as a ‘package deal’
The Big 12’s not expanding now, but these two will be frequently discussed if it ever does.
https://www.sbnation.com/college-footba ... -expansion" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Well, then that's a guarantee that neither will get in. Thanks Florida politicians....it makes the Big 12's decision that much easier. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I could see one of them, maybe(not really)....but, not both.

With conferences starting to focus on saving money on travel....I'm glad the Big 12 is being cautious with their decision. Hopefully, they won't add schools that make travel much worse than it is already.

Distance from Orlando to:

Morgantown = 898
Austin = 1127
Manhatten = 1357
Ames = 1371
Lubbock = 1435

Distance from Morgantown to:

Ames = 862
Manhatten = 981
Austin = 1400
Lubbock = 1465

The Big 12 doesn't need another school far away from the core schools....let alone 2 of them.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 6:44 pm 
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I think focus should be more on creating marque match ups. There is a reason why UT-Notre Dame and UT-USC games get such high ratings. Sure UCF-USF has great ratings, but can they do that consistently? How much of those ratings were because of the interest in Scott Frost?

Next, does UCF/USF addition move the money needle enough cover the added travel costs and leave a good chunk left over?

Next, will UT and OU fans/alumni be happy having their bluebloods with their storied histories being associated with upstart programs with no history, and who are looking to boost their financial and visibility profiles by being in the same conference as UT and OU?

Are UT and OU really committed to the Big 12 beyond 2025? I know you think that UT will never abandon Tech/Baylor, but I think that’s not the case. Neither of those schools is rival in the traditional sense of the word, and if UT can easily give up playing A&M, one of the oldest and most heated rivalries in all of college sport, I don’t see why giving up Tech and Baylor/TCU will be a problem.

In the old 12 team Big12, UT played 7-8 games in Texas, no reason it can’t still play 6-8 games in a Texas in another conference. In a 12/14/16 team conference, UT can easily play 6-8 games in Texas, assuming the OU game continues in Dallas.

I don’t see many benefits for UT in being conference partners with UCF/USF. It’s not UTs job to help other programs build up their financial and exposure profiles, particularly programs that are really not wanted by anyone else (at least as far as P5 are concerned).

The congressman would do better to pressure UF/Miami/FSU into having UCF/USF enter the SEC or ACC. If there is a real threat of the ACC or SEC adding them maybe then the B12 should look at them. Until then the perception that the Big 12 expanded with lesser/unwanted teams will only hurt the Big 12, as well UT and OU brands.

mozilla wrote:
joeben69 wrote:
This Florida politician insists the Big 12 add UCF and USF as a ‘package deal’
The Big 12’s not expanding now, but these two will be frequently discussed if it ever does.
https://www.sbnation.com/college-footba ... -expansion" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Well, then that's a guarantee that neither will get in. Thanks Florida politicians....it makes the Big 12's decision that much easier. :lol: :lol: :lol:

I could see one of them, maybe(not really)....but, not both.

With conferences starting to focus on saving money on travel....I'm glad the Big 12 is being cautious with their decision. Hopefully, they won't add schools that make travel much worse than it is already.

Distance from Orlando to:

Morgantown = 898
Austin = 1127
Manhatten = 1357
Ames = 1371
Lubbock = 1435

Distance from Morgantown to:

Ames = 862
Manhatten = 981
Austin = 1400
Lubbock = 1465

The Big 12 doesn't need another school far away from the core schools....let alone 2 of them.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 2:37 pm 
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freaked4collegefb wrote:
Article out of Fort Collins discussing how the 2016 Big 12 expansion candidates have fared since at https://www.coloradoan.com/story/sports ... 006929001/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

A few threads back I posted the ten schools that continued to be discussed as expansion candidates last year and actually left out Rice. Apologies because Rice was kept on the list for good reasons. When the Big 12 were considering expansion last year there were discussion on expanding with either 12 or 14 schools and this is most likely why these 11 group of five schools continued on the list while some notable good football schools dropped off. It was clear the Big 12 were not just looking at football and dropped Boise State and Memphis from consideration while keeping Rice and Tulane on the list due to academics.

This is only a guess however some schools paired well together including Rice and Tulane that would have scored by far the highest on academic considerations of those 11 schools.

SMU was kept on the list due to Boone Pickers of Oklahoma State and others wanting that school included is another guess. Having TCU in the Dallas/Ft Worth area most likely would have not taken the Mustangs to the top of the four or most likely final two expansion candidates.

Colorado State and Air Force were most likely kept on the list due to the pressure of a lot of Media to include BYU for football attendance. Both schools paired well if the Big 12 went west with BYU.

The University of Houston were kept on the list because of Texas politics and playing some good football.

Here is how this probably would have played out had the Big 12 pulled the trigger and expanded.

I do not believe the league would have expanded with 14 schools even if there were a possibility of a regular cable network. Most power leagues have always expanded in pairs.

Potential pairing of two schools were as follows:

Tulane/Rice
SMU/Houston
UCF/USF
BYU/Colorado State/Air Force
Cincinnati/UConn

At the end of the day what factors weighed the highest would have probably won over the decision had the Big 12 made the decision to expand last year.

If the Big 12 resumed the discussion on expansion the same type of factors would be relevant, academics, athletics, TV markets.

The Big 12 made many comments last year that geography had not real weight in decisions.

I would rule out BYU and probably the Colorado schools if the Big 12 expanded today with the negative issues BYU brought to the table with honor code etc.

I would rule out additional Texas schools because only Texas pushed for the University of Houston and that was political reasons.

I would rule out purely academic benefits unless the league were looking at 14 and eliminate Tulane and Rice due the above issue of having too many Texas schools.

Cincinnati along with BYU were always rumored to be the top two preference with gaining the most percentage of the necessary votes. Since the Big 12 did not expand it is reasonable to believe the Big 12 could not come to a consensus and get the eight votes for the correct pair of schools.

If the Big 12 made an expansion decision today based on the weighted factors, it would be a good bet that Cincinnati and UCF would get a lot of votes. The question is could both get eight votes that would be necessary for the Big 12 to make the decision to expand.

Some factors excluding TV that could have some influence may push the Big 12 expansion discussions with the Big Ten, ACC, and SEC going with a 20 game basketball schedule. This is additional revenue left on the table. The other issue that did not impact the Big 12 this year is a rematch keeping the Big 12 football champion out of the college football playoff.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:25 am 
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3rdGenHorn wrote:
I think focus should be more on creating marque match ups. There is a reason why UT-Notre Dame and UT-USC games get such high ratings. Sure UCF-USF has great ratings, but can they do that consistently? How much of those ratings were because of the interest in Scott Frost?

Next, does UCF/USF addition move the money needle enough cover the added travel costs and leave a good chunk left over?

Next, will UT and OU fans/alumni be happy having their bluebloods with their storied histories being associated with upstart programs with no history, and who are looking to boost their financial and visibility profiles by being in the same conference as UT and OU?

Are UT and OU really committed to the Big 12 beyond 2025? I know you think that UT will never abandon Tech/Baylor, but I think that’s not the case. Neither of those schools is rival in the traditional sense of the word, and if UT can easily give up playing A&M, one of the oldest and most heated rivalries in all of college sport, I don’t see why giving up Tech and Baylor/TCU will be a problem.

In the old 12 team Big12, UT played 7-8 games in Texas, no reason it can’t still play 6-8 games in a Texas in another conference. In a 12/14/16 team conference, UT can easily play 6-8 games in Texas, assuming the OU game continues in Dallas.

I don’t see many benefits for UT in being conference partners with UCF/USF. It’s not UTs job to help other programs build up their financial and exposure profiles, particularly programs that are really not wanted by anyone else (at least as far as P5 are concerned).

The congressman would do better to pressure UF/Miami/FSU into having UCF/USF enter the SEC or ACC. If there is a real threat of the ACC or SEC adding them maybe then the B12 should look at them. Until then the perception that the Big 12 expanded with lesser/unwanted teams will only hurt the Big 12, as well UT and OU brands.


You make some points I agree with...and some I don't. I will focus on some of the items I don't agree with.

I don't know what factors you use to decide if a school is a rival or not(UCF and USF have only played 9 times)....but, here are UT's biggest rivals(from the point of view of a Longhorn, RedRaider and a Texan, ie: me): with game totals

1. Oklahoma 112
2. Arkansas 78
3. aTm 118
4. Tech 67
5. Baylor 107
6. Rice 94
7. TCU 88
8. SMU 73

Texas wants to play these schools. Texas fans want to play these schools. Oklahoma is our biggest rival...which made aTm mad. Arkansas was our second rival...which made aTm mad. Tech was encroaching on aTm's spot at 3....which made aTm mad. Tech was becoming aTm's biggest rival, since they thought UT was snubbing them....which again....made aTm mad. aTm was becoming fully disgruntled....so, they left. I say good riddance....and welcome back to the flock TCU.

You said...."if UT can easily give up playing A&M".
UT didn't give up on anything. aTm left the conference. UT didn't have a word to say about it. It was aTm's decision. ...and the people in Austin or UT respect aTm's decision on the subject. They have the right to play in whatever conference they want. And to be truthful...I am glad they are gone. TCU is a much better conference mate. aTm was becoming a big cry baby(which is a discussion for another time). With aTm, Nebraska, and Arkansas....off the schedule....it is that much more important to Texas...to have Baylor, TCU and Tech on their schedule. Which is why they won't want to give up on these other three schools, without replacing one with Rice, SMU or maybe even UofH. For about 100 years or so....Texas has played their state of Texas partners....they DON'T want to give that up.

Something else you may want to pay attention to.....There isn't 1 school that has left the Big12....that has scored a fb game against the conference again. Not Colorado, Nebraska, aTm, or Missouri. It is a decision by the conference to not give those schools any kind of a sniff at a schedule spot. And I, totally agree with that decision. They left....so, good bye.

Texas has worked hard to keep their schedule strong since aTm and Missouri left. (in 6 years of scheduling)Playing Ole Miss twice, BYU twice, UCLA, Notre Dame twice, California twice, USC twice(counting 2018), Maryland twice(2018), ....and regional schools like New Mexico, New Mexico State, N. Texas, Rice, UTEP, and Tulsa(2018). Texas' scheduling is fine without aTm. We have moved on.

If you want marque match ups from the Go5 group....the number 1 school the Big 12 should focus on is Navy. Navy is near WVU and has a strong history playing some of the best schools in the country.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 2:18 am 
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Does the Big 12 Conference need BYU football to survive?
https://lawlessrepublic.com/2018/01/16/ ... -football/


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