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PostPosted: Fri Jun 13, 2014 4:57 pm 
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Considering Texas wants nothing to do with the SEC, I'm thinking the next SEC additions would be North Carolina and Virginia Tech.


As crazy at it sounds, I think the most significant dominoes in major realignment are UNC and Duke. Here's why...

Future Big Ten targets would likely be Virginia and either UNC, UConn or Syracuse.
So if you have the Big Ten after Virginia; the SEC after Va Tech; and both after UNC, wherever UNC decides to go is dictating the next step. If the B10 adds UNC/UVA first, the SEC might not have a significant reason to expand.

Now for Duke. All of those are ACC schools, save UConn. So the ACC has to make their wishlist of 1-4 schools to replace. UConn would be first; but after that? Cincinnati, Memphis... I think the ACC is going to put a phone call in to Lawrence, Kansas. For Duke, who else do you want replacing UNC but Kansas?

And keep in mind, all these rumors would be flying around at the same time. The SEC/Big Ten would be calling Texas; Most of the ACC and Big XII would be calling the Big Ten and SEC; Which means American members are calling everyone.

The rumors of Kansas talking to the ACC would make the Big XII realize: "these guys are going to have 16 members, we're at 10. We can keep Kansas, and WE can add Duke, along with Florida State, Miami, Georgia Tech, Clemson and NC State!

And this is how Duke becomes the lynchpin. Florida State, Miami and Ga Tech would be the first ACC schools on the Big XII's list. Clemson, NC State and Duke makes perfect sense for 16 for the Big XII.

But Duke won't be thrilled to sever their tie to SU/Pitt/BC in the northeast. They will have a choice to make:

-- Can a private, small, and not so good at football school afford to not go the Big XII?
-- Do they rebuild the ACC with SU/Pitt/BC/Wake/ND/Louisville and American schools to maintain a Northeast presence?
-- Do they try and convince the Big XII to maybe skip Clemson/NC State, and include Syracuse/Pitt for the last two spots?
-- At what point do the conversations turn from "Which two of Clemson, NC State, Syracuse, Pitt, Notre Dame, or BC should teams #15 and #16" to "At least FOUR of those teams bring more to the table than Texas Tech, Iowa State and Kansas State. Why don't we form a NEW conference with the best 16?"

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PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2014 5:52 pm 
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JPSchmack wrote:
Considering Texas wants nothing to do with the SEC, I'm thinking the next SEC additions would be North Carolina and Virginia Tech.


It depends on who decides to move first and where. Texas, or any other may say 'no' now to other possibilities, but flip the decision in the future when new circumstances arise.

It's not a secret the SEC wants into North Carolina. Really, UNC or NCSU would be the only schools that could satisfy SEC expansion objectives there. Penetrating in Virginia could possibly be just a complicated or more so than, say, being able to extract a school such as NCSU.

What may happen after a super-type division gets grounded, the broadcasting networks are going assert themselves into all this in an even more intensified way. The SEC is going to be ESPN's top feature by far. The ACC, also with ESPN, shall be positioned at a #2 status, of which ESPN shall retain major leverage in keeping them featured and determining their broadcasting worth. ESPN could essentially say to the ACC, 'let's move NCSU (or another) to the SEC, and if you pick up UConn (or another such as Cincy), we will enhance your package by "X" number of dollars'. The SEC would be expected to cooperate with new interactive games with the ACC, as well as new and improved bowl arrangements. The ACC's GoR could yield to exceptions with a new money deal. There will also be an increased press to enhance ND's fb commitment.

There's not going to be a conspiracy between the SEC and the B1G to divide up schools in North Carolina and Virginia. It's not just conference and footprint competition involved, but also competition with the major broadcasters over markets. Also, the ACC do not want to break-up; most of their schools really want to remain in the ACC. And far as the SEC goes, they may want to extract one or two schools from the ACC, not splinter the conference three-ways with a couple of other power conferences. Thus, in dealing with the ACC and ESPN, the SEC has some advantage over the B1G, focusing particularly on the more southern sector of the ACC. And while the SEC does not currently want to accept in-state additions, that sentiment could change, and somebody such as FSU could become a serious SEC candidate.

For the SEC to take another from the B12, that would probably hinge on others there moving elsewhere first. Again, it could relate to a broadcasting deal. Let's remember, Texas' LHN is an ESPN-related enterprise. That's not to suggest that Texas and the SEC shall one day bond; but rather, it is one of several influencing factors per broadcasting that may impact future B12 movement.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 15, 2014 11:22 am 
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Article out of Columbia(previously posted in another thread) with comments from MU AD regarding SEC Network conference realignment and other issues at http://www.columbiatribune.com/sports/t ... b2370.html


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 11:11 am 
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Congratulations to Georgia AD McGarity and Mark Richt as the latest Notre Dame enablers! Tell Swarbrick and Brian Kelly to come on in and get a shot at more Peach State recruits. UGA has scheduled ND in fb for 2017 and 2019. Is this a hot-seat gamble for Mark?

So the Irish had been scheduled to play teams from every major conference, except the SEC, and Jack just needs to fix this as if this is an entitlement. All this after ND had been canceling or jerking around B1G schools such as Michigan, MSU, and Purdue while declaring games with USC, Stanford, and Navy as sacred. ND whims that they have it so difficult in scheduling games is pure bull.

Notre Dame tells the ACC they can only do 5 rotating ACC games in exchange for membership in all else with the ACC and access to their bowls. ND is also in a fine position to self-serve, and there are no repercussions if any of it is at the expense of the ACC.

Georgia Tech is in sort of a current downward spiral athletically and couldn't Swofford had pushed ND to do something for the conference and GT beyond the ND rotations with GT and others? Swofford needs to understand ND is not representing the ACC in playing Georgia and in a state whereby an ACC member is already largely over-shadowed.

If the B1G still has eyes on Georgia Tech, they need to keep in mind this is not the GT of 'old. Weak, and the ACC is not strong enough to use their own schools to influence ND's agenda further.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 11:31 am 
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sec03 wrote:
Congratulations to Georgia AD McGarity and Mark Richt as the latest Notre Dame enablers! Tell Swarbrick and Brian Kelly to come on in and get a shot at more Peach State recruits. UGA has scheduled ND in fb for 2017 and 2019. Is this a hot-seat gamble for Mark?

So the Irish had been scheduled to play teams from every major conference, except the SEC, and Jack just needs to fix this as if this is an entitlement. All this after ND had been canceling or jerking around B1G schools such as Michigan, MSU, and Purdue while declaring games with USC, Stanford, and Navy as sacred. ND whims that they have it so difficult in scheduling games is pure bull.

Notre Dame tells the ACC they can only do 5 rotating ACC games in exchange for membership in all else with the ACC and access to their bowls. ND is also in a fine position to self-serve, and there are no repercussions if any of it is at the expense of the ACC.

Georgia Tech is in sort of a current downward spiral athletically and couldn't Swofford had pushed ND to do something for the conference and GT beyond the ND rotations with GT and others? Swofford needs to understand ND is not representing the ACC in playing Georgia and in a state whereby an ACC member is already largely over-shadowed.

If the B1G still has eyes on Georgia Tech, they need to keep in mind this is not the GT of 'old. Weak, and the ACC is not strong enough to use their own schools to influence ND's agenda further.


It worth mentioning that ND is making less than 20 million a year with its NBC deals (that runs through 2025) and its ACC payout-bowl revenue (as ND keeps all of its own). Still this shows that ND is falling further behind as every major conference will be paying its members 20m+ (only the PAC12/ACC aren't doing this already).

This is ND's last attmept at independence, they HAVE to be successful and make this work or come 2025 they'll be forced to join a conference (ACC or B1G) or be left behind (both in $$ and access to the playoffs/BCS bowls).

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 12:01 pm 
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sec03 wrote:
Congratulations to Georgia AD McGarity and Mark Richt as the latest Notre Dame enablers! Tell Swarbrick and Brian Kelly to come on in and get a shot at more Peach State recruits. UGA has scheduled ND in fb for 2017 and 2019. Is this a hot-seat gamble for Mark?

So the Irish had been scheduled to play teams from every major conference, except the SEC, and Jack just needs to fix this as if this is an entitlement. All this after ND had been canceling or jerking around B1G schools such as Michigan, MSU, and Purdue while declaring games with USC, Stanford, and Navy as sacred. ND whims that they have it so difficult in scheduling games is pure bull.

Notre Dame tells the ACC they can only do 5 rotating ACC games in exchange for membership in all else with the ACC and access to their bowls. ND is also in a fine position to self-serve, and there are no repercussions if any of it is at the expense of the ACC.

Georgia Tech is in sort of a current downward spiral athletically and couldn't Swofford had pushed ND to do something for the conference and GT beyond the ND rotations with GT and others? Swofford needs to understand ND is not representing the ACC in playing Georgia and in a state whereby an ACC member is already largely over-shadowed.

If the B1G still has eyes on Georgia Tech, they need to keep in mind this is not the GT of 'old. Weak, and the ACC is not strong enough to use their own schools to influence ND's agenda further.


It isn't just the B1G they hosed. They hosed BC and Pitt, too. Pitt goes further back than Stanford. Stanford only serves as a west coast game during the Thanksgiving weekend...there's nothing traditional about it. Stanford got a game with a marquee opponent when they were a doormat in the PAC, and Notre Dame got to keep a spot in CA.

It's not like Notre Dame made it a secret that they really liked dipping into the South for recruiting, but it's becoming more and more obvious now that they actually DO really need it. I think that was part of the ACC's allure...it got them into GA and FL, but not necessarily "the heart" of those areas, as the SEC ones possess. It's a shame a SEC program had to indulge the Irish, though I'm sure the money is going to be quite nice.

I think GT should be a bit miffed by this, though. They have history with ND, and they could actually use the games with them more frequently. But, the ACC bent over, waaaay over, and gave away the farm, putting BC, Pitt, and GT in the same collective pot as schools who never had anything to do with the Irish, as well as others who grew tired of the Irish's antics in the Big East (Syracuse) and letting the Irish get away with these self-serving dalliances to the detriment of fully vested ACC members. I just don't get it with Swofford. He's awful.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 1:28 pm 
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tkalmus, TBC:

You do know that this series with UGA is going to be at the expense of the games Notre Dame had signed with Texas? ND is changing for 2017 and wants to postpone 2019 game vs Texas. ND either had a clause in the contract with Texas that they could do this, or Texas agreed to postpone some of the 4-games series with ND per the timeline.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 2:36 pm 
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sec03 wrote:
tkalmus, TBC:

You do know that this series with UGA is going to be at the expense of the games Notre Dame had signed with Texas? ND is changing for 2017 and wants to postpone 2019 game vs Texas. ND either had a clause in the contract with Texas that they could do this, or Texas agreed to postpone some of the 4-games series with ND per the timeline.


It doesn't mess with the first series in 2015 & 2016, only the first game of the second series in 2019 & 2020.

Its not finalized but it looks like the 2019 game in Austin will simply be postponed until 2021 when both teams have avalability making it a 2020 & 2021 series.

This isn't a big deal IMO ...the big deal is whether or not our scheduled series with Maryland still happens in 2017 & 2018 as we've had issue working with the Big Ten replay rights in the past.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 4:53 pm 
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It seems like the game means enough to both of them if they didn't cancel the second set, but I don't see this as being anything other than the constraints of ND's new arrangements and the rigidities of other programs' schedules in conferences. They should just call September "OOC Month." In theory, I guess UGA-ND could happen in late October or early/mid November because of the SEC's eight game conference scheduling and the late season cupcake game most take, but they're in the September bloc...which then makes me wonder why the Irish couldn't get it done with one of their other shunned traditional rivals. "Priorities."


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2014 3:04 pm 
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Kevin Scarbinsky of AL.com (Alabama) reply to Orlando Columnist Mike Bianchi words who was advocating for adding UCF & UCF to the SEC at the expense of the Mississippi schools. 6/10/2014 - "Imagining the SEC's rejection letter should UCF and USF apply for membership".

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014 ... ion_l.html


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2014 9:33 pm 
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sec03 wrote:
Kevin Scarbinsky of AL.com (Alabama) reply to Orlando Columnist Mike Bianchi words who was advocating for adding UCF & UCF to the SEC at the expense of the Mississippi schools. 6/10/2014 - "Imagining the SEC's rejection letter should UCF and USF apply for membership".

http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014 ... ion_l.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

To be fair...

There really isn't a good reason to have 2 schools in Mississippi.

I'm sure if the SEC could start again they wouldn't be bringing in Mississippi State when they could replace them with Oklahoma, Texas, Kansas, FSU, UNC or even Clemson.

My dream conference thread imaged a scenario where the SEC and ACC swapped Mississippi State for NCSU that way both could get exposures in new markets and reduce the unnecessary redundancies (I also picture Auburn and VPI swapping too for similar reasons but that would even more unlikely as both are competitive).

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2014 11:40 pm 
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Or UCF and USF can head to the B12 and UT and TTU can be swopped out to cusa. Baylor and TCU got Texas covered. ;)

Seriously, the B12 has the politics of 'sister' schools as much as anyone.
There's a value to it, otherwise Oklahoma and Oklahoma State would be sitting in another conference right now.

The thought of removing charter members or any other based on the idea to stretch TV and recruiting demographics is only embracing one preference and dismissing all the other traditional and fundamental considerations.

Attrition should be natural and it does happen over time or in short order. And it is not all based on school sizes, W-L records, and prejudices. Suwanee, Tulane, and Georgia Tech left the SEC for varying reasons over a long dated period of time. Colorado, Nebraska, Texas A&M, and Missouri left the B12 and none of them were overtly forced away.

To 'Temple' a school needs to be a 'just cause'. And even Temple was brought back to the old BE when new depletions happened and desperation was abound.

If the SEC was being set-up today certainly it would look differently. Maybe there would be one or no Mississippi schools. But it would depend on who are the core for the movement. MSU and Ole Miss were major in the original core.

UCF and USF are growing and advancing in central/southern Florida market and each can point to certain successes including UCF's bowl win over Baylor. But that is not a ticket on demand to the SEC. Nor is it proof that their highly populated and concentrated demographic trumps the tradition and enthusiasm exhibited elsewhere within the SEC footprint, particularly where the geographic heart lies.

Not sure the SEC craves any fix, but if it does, tossing away Mississippi for a couple of directional, commuter Florida schools will not be the answer. Not one current SEC school would support switching out, say, MSU for UCF. The University of Florida and a formidable group of others in the SEC don't want even FSU--and they are very SEC-like in multiple dimensions---including a recent national championship. They are not after Miami either. But they would take USF and/or UCF? No way.
The two Mississippi schools are only occasional powers within the SEC, but their fan support and facilities are not in any kind of decline. Mississippi State, for example, has expanded Scott Field, from around 35,000 or so in 1980 to approximately 61,000-plus now (certainly not the upper tier in the SEC, but compares well across the country). And those folks do have consistent sell-outs. Two years ago or so, I saw one publication that had them ranked #1 in growth of fan support.

MSU for NCSU? Why not UNC or Ohio State or Notre Dame? All those are contiguous by state. These are not trades. Even if desired, a conference cannot take what's not available to them.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 6:46 pm 
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If I was the SEC Commissioner and I had to replace Arkansas i'd replace the Razorbacks with the Texas Longhorns. My reasoning for the Longhorns is that I think Texas could have really good football games possibly with the LSU Tigers and past Big 12 foe Missouri. Also I think Texas offers a lot to the SEC in football and especially men's basketball with a solid men's basketball team


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 10:26 am 
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Pretty sure that Arkansas isn't going anywhere.... (no need to replace them).

At some point in the future, the SEC my choose to expand by 2 (to 16 schools).
It wouldn't shock me if they gave a hard look at the Oklahoma schools.

Don't you think TA&M would try to veto Texas joining the SEC ?
A&M bolted to the SEC to get out of Texas's shadow (and the Longhorns' manipulation of the Big XII, such as having their own TV network)...


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 12:35 pm 
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tute79 wrote:
At some point in the future, the SEC my choose to expand by 2 (to 16 schools).

Don't you think TA&M would try to veto Texas joining the SEC ?

ESPN bloggers are kicking up the thoughts:

http://espn.go.com/blog/sec/post/_/id/8 ... sion-teams" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Bring back GT and Tulane? (then-- the could do better comment)
Miami and Louisville? (the returned Petrino is suppose to be there for ages as a reason and in the state where UK resides?)
UNC and VPI (certainly firmly in the ballpark of what the SEC would take if the opportunity presented itself).

My speculative personal view and probably as good or better than what ESPN bloggers suggest:

Any potential SEC additions would come from two of four states:
1. North Carolina: UNC would be the jewel there. If not, NCSU. UNC with Duke if that was required to get UNC and no favored options were available in Virginia or elsewhere and the B1G was making further in-roads into the ACC.
2. Virgina: UVA or VPI; preferably coupled with UNC or NCSU.
3. Oklahoma: OU preferably, but alone from the state. But just OSU from there could be settled on as a secondary move--given a certain scenario.
4. Texas: University of Texas would be the only one to be considered from there. TA&M's reaction may be unclear, but Univ. of Texas' earnings power is exceptional and not something to dismiss.
* FSU could be an exception to the limitations. While in-footprint, they are in a major state, and have very high market value in fb. FSU has a national brand name with championships. SEC could modify their stance about in-footprint FSU.

None of the above is realistic right now. Some don't want to transition to the SEC or elsewhere, others have uncompromising attitudes and demands, and all are currently locked-into their current situations. And taking two from the 'west' certainly would generate some intense discussions within the SEC about divisional set-ups.

If none of the above was available if movement was somehow allowed, and the SEC just had to get to 16; then schools such as FSU (maybe even a priority instead if more immediate), Clemson, GT, Miami, and Louisville could receive more consideration (the later two or three though, maybe not so much). Depending on what others do and only the B12 became vulnerable with limited choices, a school such as Kansas could be a darkhouse. WVU could be an option if all-else fails and expansion is a must.


Last edited by sec03 on Sun Jul 06, 2014 2:24 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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