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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 12:16 pm 
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This stuff should not be spread, but the unsubstantiated rumors keep rearing up. The point is to recognize what could be misleading content or downright fiction.

Here's a blog (looks like a new one), seemingly devoted to rumors.

http://conferenceexpansion.com/

But wait, there's more out of WV, even Morgantown at that!

http://www.sportsmancave.com/

"FSU has support of Ohio State"
"UVA is signed, sealed & delivered"
"Mich. & Illinois still cool on FSU"
'GT all cleared for it'
'UNC is starting paperwork with B1G, but chatting up with both B1G & the SEC, but leaning B1G due to academics & bb, while at the same time trying to save the ACC'
'UNC, UVA, FSU, & GT transition, ND shall be prompted to be #19, and BC added for #20'
'All awaiting the MD lawsuit settlement'

______________________________

Seriously, why would West Virginia bloggers/posters know the 'inside scoop' of what the B1G, ACC, & the SEC are doing, and such is not carried by more established & recognized media or from sources (not alledged, unnamed ones) within & close to the said conferences & schools?
Again, it appears that WVU interest sources wants to generate further, major conference movement that would have a ripple impact beneficial to WVU. Or, some just want to perpetuate rumors for the fun or sake of it, hope they are end up being on-target about something, and take credit for it. Is it playing loose with facts and throwing much 'doodo' on the wall & hoping something sticks?

The B1G is known to hold such matters very close to vest, and the leadership lets the public know what they want them to know and when. Previously, the SEC has been pretty straight-up about if and when they intend to expand and with whom and how it's to be done.

As to UNC, they would not be doing paperwork for the B1G, and trying to save the ACC (at the same time). Obviously, UNC (and some others) are focused on the latter.

And FSU? They are very experienced with expansion rumors and have the proven capacity to handle their own; not buy in to those generated from elsewhere.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 1:36 pm 
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I don't know what the point of getting GT would be if they had to sacrifice the UGA game for that membership. It's not like Big Ten schools have deep alumni pockets in Atlanta. I know it's a great school and all, and maybe part of the appeal is trying to tap elite public institutions with sizable international student populations (spread the brand), but they'd stick out worse than Rutgers.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:06 pm 
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Delany's too busy to raid the ACC right now:

1) he could make a hasty mistake and accidently invite half of the "AAC" by mistake !!!

2) the Big Ten has to sort out the entire issue of new names with regard to this "Legends" and "Leaders" stuff....

3) it's WAY too much fun to leak rumors to "the Dude" at WVU, and see how far they go.
the latest one involves right after Tom Osborne dies, the Big Ten will trade with the Big XII - Nebraska for WVU..... "it's as good as a done deal !"


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:43 pm 
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Perhaps the B1G shall expand again at some point, but personally, I don't expect it to be soon. Some of the names would be obvious targets for more expansion; that's not too difficult to contemplate.

The messages that UVA is already onboard, and UNC is doing the paperwork is apt to be bogus. These are public institutions, and thus there are certain protocols and approval procedures, perhaps even to apply. Each school's governance, mainly Board of Trustees, would need to validate. There's the freedom of information factor. And University executives would seek concurrence from major political figures (Governor, key legislators, etc.) and major boosters and planned-givers.

The Maryland President, it was allegedly claimed, did not consult with the school's BoTs' on certain negotiating issues with the B1G. First, I find that difficult to believe given the magnitude of the ultimate decision. It probably was more the Maryland BoTs' was well aware of the discussions, had at least informally agreed to give the President and his team the freedom to engage the B1G, and do what's best to bring relief regarding the school's cash-strapped athletic program. Then, the recommended decision would be taken to BoTs' for formal approval. I expect the Maryland BoTs' knew from the get-go what was transpiring, but not all of them were formally briefed on each and every detail prior to the President's final recommendation. The Maryland BoTs' certainly approved (or accepted) prior expenditures (such as Byrd stadium's new box seat renovations/expansion) that helped get them in the financial dog house; so for their own reputations and appointments, they would not be so disconnected on the process to find a solution.

Second, some, if not all, of these schools have issued denials about any decisions to pursue the B1G or that the B1G (or SEC, B12) has (formally) invited them. That does not mean they don't talk. They chat about this stuff all the time at organizational meetings, over the phone, at golf outings, etc. They all know each other for the most part. I am certain the B1G, SEC, B12, etc. have sought/garnered, informally, certain schools interests in moving, and what their terms would be just in case. Also, I expect each major conference have undisclosed plans of what moves they would pursue given certain scenarios. That's part of the Commish's job. And, a school may tell the inquiring conference(s), "if 'X' happens or 'Y' happens we'll want to talk turkey with you".

Regarding some posts upward, it does seem these conferences have scheduling issues to finish working out with '14' or so; and new, immediate adding only complicates further who plays whom and how often. And these cheating scandals and crazy antics, just don't go away.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:31 pm 
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I have no insider information but I do believe the B1G goes to 16 before their next TV contract is finalized and I believe those schools will come from the ACC.

I believe that the B1G's goal is UVa, UNC, GT and FSU. I think they may have to settle for UVa and FSU.

If expansion is about money then those markets make the BTN tons of money. As far as the schools, With Notre Dame, each ACC school will get 18+ million each, B1G schools after their new TV contract (with FOX and BTN share) will get 35+ million.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:00 am 
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sec03 wrote:
The Maryland President, it was allegedly claimed, did not consult with the school's BoTs' on certain negotiating issues with the B1G. First, I find that difficult to believe given the magnitude of the ultimate decision. It probably was more the Maryland BoTs' was well aware of the discussions, had at least informally agreed to give the President and his team the freedom to engage the B1G, and do what's best to bring relief regarding the school's cash-strapped athletic program. Then, the recommended decision would be taken to BoTs' for formal approval. I expect the Maryland BoTs' knew from the get-go what was transpiring, but not all of them were formally briefed on each and every detail prior to the President's final recommendation. The Maryland BoTs' certainly approved (or accepted) prior expenditures (such as Byrd stadium's new box seat renovations/expansion) that helped get them in the financial dog house; so for their own reputations and appointments, they would not be so disconnected on the process to find a solution.


Yeah, these relationships happen over years of informal, then formal discussions (and in that order). And they don't just happen to find their way in front of clueless board members. Even in UMD's case, the one guy who spoke out about being "blindsided" was just that: one guy. The Board almost unanimously voted for the move; they had no problem with it. They knew. And in the Big Ten especially, these "chats" happened over several years (and in Nebraska and Rutgers' respective cases, many).

However, I do question the authenticity of any NDA. Non-profit, tax-funded, and mostly public institutions of higher education with amateur sports under a "volunteer" governing body resorting to those means can't be everything UMD's president described. Like the supposed exit fees, GoR, and other "binding" arrangements, it's just red tape that nobody would want to challenge. God bless FoI, but it seems like the Big Ten knows how to cloak themselves enough.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:25 am 
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seanbo wrote:

I believe that the B1G's goal is UVa, UNC, GT and FSU. I think they may have to settle for UVa and FSU.


Looks like the plausible wish list. The 4 would be contiguous connections in a southern string. Some scenarios have Kansas as an inclusion, but that seems more speculative unless that B12 GoR has a real weakness.

The rumors that fluorish, take this unconfirmed list, or versions of it or individual schools from within, and inject stories, some of which are ridiculous, for various motives.

It's certainly thinkable, given all the loot that may on the table, the B1G, if it intends to be real aggressive, could lure UVA and FSU and/or GT, and later try to 'fill-in" more among UNC, ND, or Kansas.

All this looks potentially possible. But North Carolina is no easy target, and the SEC would be making its own overtures.

Among the 4, I believe GT and FSU, in practical terms, are less bonded to the ACC persona.

I believe it was Bishon Cutter that commented on the UGA-GT game, and the potential of losing it if GT goes to the B1G. Really, that is a huge factor. GT lost regular season rivalries with Tennessee, Alabama, and Auburn. That has hurt over time. To lose the UGA game, plus Clemson, that shall hurt much deeper. Going to Iowa, Rutgers, Minnesota, etc., shall not fix it, even if GT receives an enhanced conference distribution. FSU would also want to secure the Florida game if they transition. It's unclear what guarantees the B1G would make regarding scheduling flexibilities. In the ACC, at least Clemson, FSU, Louisville, and GT can retain regular season games with in-state arch-rivals.

But money and TV contracts are powerful. And that has already messed up some great traditional rivalries elsewhere. These network decision-makers look at city markets and broadcast rights, and some, along with the constant turn-over of school executives, may be clueless, or don't care, about a school's historical roots and fabric, and shall count on advertisers, from Chick-Fil-A to Geico Insurance to carry them through it.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 11:44 am 
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I think the talk about the Big Ten going after Georgia Tech is an attempt at hitting the SEC. There is no way the Big Ten could get an SEC school (unless the unthinkable happens and the SEC kicks someone out). So the best they can do is hit deep into SEC territory. Take Georgia Tech and you have a team in Atlanta, the de facto capital of the SEC. How much press coverage of the Big Ten is there in Atlanta. Somewhere between zero and a brief mention when an SEC school destroys one of their teams on the football field. If a local school is in the Big Ten, that would be a huge jump in the amount of press the Big Ten gets in Atlanta. I know Georgia Tech is maybe the second most popular school in Atlanta if they are lucky but it is still well enough liked they get a large amount of press coverage in Atlanta. While I don't really believe the Big Ten is anywhere close to inviting Georgia Tech right now, there is some logic behind why they would.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:56 pm 
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Academically, if the B1G can't get UVA or UNC, and won't take Pitt, GT's that next best "Big Ten-type." Ahead of the Missouri's and Kansas's. I get the logic of them at that level, as well as the media permeation...I just think the local media would likely sever them almost entirely if they did leave their regional companions behind.

FSU's an even bigger mistake for both sides. It's nearly impossible to take it seriously. They'd break off with Miami and Florida, and the Big Ten would get what? I know they love football down there...but they sometimes don't even fill their own joint. How's that going to go when Northwestern and Indiana come to town? Or are their fans going to make the trip up to Minnesota and Wisconsin in November for football, or January and February for hoops?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 3:46 pm 
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The Bishin Cutter wrote:
Academically, if the B1G can't get UVA or UNC, and won't take Pitt, GT's that next best "Big Ten-type." Ahead of the Missouri's and Kansas's. I get the logic of them at that level, as well as the media permeation...I just think the local media would likely sever them almost entirely if they did leave their regional companions behind.

FSU's an even bigger mistake for both sides. It's nearly impossible to take it seriously. They'd break off with Miami and Florida, and the Big Ten would get what? I know they love football down there...but they sometimes don't even fill their own joint. How's that going to go when Northwestern and Indiana come to town? Or are their fans going to make the trip up to Minnesota and Wisconsin in November for football, or January and February for hoops?


Why again would Florida and Miami break off?

Will Duke / Pitt sell out? I know FSU-Michigan, FSU-Ohio State, FSU-Penn State, FSU-Wisconsin, and FSU-Nebraska will. ACC offers us Clemson and Virginia Tech.

Will they travel to Minnesota and Wisconsin? Will they travel to Boston and Syracuse?

Florida's 5 million plus cable subscribers aren't laughable to the Big Ten Network. Whether it's enough is another question but it would be immediately dismissed.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 9:28 am 
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seanbo wrote:
Why again would Florida and Miami break off?


The Big Ten's scheduling system. UMFL might be salvageable, because it's usually pretty early in the season, but UF is toast. No way in the blazes do UF, FSU, and the B1G allow that to work where it is...and no way does it sit in a non-conference portion where UMFL usually is anyway. FSU would literally play the hardest schedule every year.

Quote:
Will Duke / Pitt sell out? I know FSU-Michigan, FSU-Ohio State, FSU-Penn State, FSU-Wisconsin, and FSU-Nebraska will. ACC offers us Clemson and Virginia Tech.


Those games would sell out because the B1G schools travel, as well as show up in droves to their own home games. Can FSU travel? Do they travel well to schools only two or three states away?

Quote:
Will they travel to Minnesota and Wisconsin? Will they travel to Boston and Syracuse?


I've lived in the North Atlantic for most of my life. There is no way in the blazes it compares to what they get up in midwest. Syracuse may get a ton of lake-effect snow...Minnesota just gets SNOW...and that unforgiving Canadian dry air.

Even supposing FSU were to join...they aren't winning up in the far north very often. Michigan's rough enough...as is Happy Valley when the air starts to turn.

Quote:
Florida's 5 million plus cable subscribers aren't laughable to the Big Ten Network. Whether it's enough is another question but it would be immediately dismissed.


This I don't dismiss. But, it's the only thing I don't.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:08 am 
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The Bishin Cutter wrote:
seanbo wrote:
Why again would Florida and Miami break off?


The Big Ten's scheduling system. UMFL might be salvageable, because it's usually pretty early in the season, but UF is toast. No way in the blazes do UF, FSU, and the B1G allow that to work where it is...and no way does it sit in a non-conference portion where UMFL usually is anyway. FSU would literally play the hardest schedule every year.

Quote:
Will Duke / Pitt sell out? I know FSU-Michigan, FSU-Ohio State, FSU-Penn State, FSU-Wisconsin, and FSU-Nebraska will. ACC offers us Clemson and Virginia Tech.


Those games would sell out because the B1G schools travel, as well as show up in droves to their own home games. Can FSU travel? Do they travel well to schools only two or three states away?

Quote:
Will they travel to Minnesota and Wisconsin? Will they travel to Boston and Syracuse?


I've lived in the North Atlantic for most of my life. There is no way in the blazes it compares to what they get up in midwest. Syracuse may get a ton of lake-effect snow...Minnesota just gets SNOW...and that unforgiving Canadian dry air.

Even supposing FSU were to join...they aren't winning up in the far north very often. Michigan's rough enough...as is Happy Valley when the air starts to turn.

Quote:
Florida's 5 million plus cable subscribers aren't laughable to the Big Ten Network. Whether it's enough is another question but it would be immediately dismissed.


This I don't dismiss. But, it's the only thing I don't.


Couldn't disagree with you more.

For one, you are telling me that UF can play a full SEC schedule and FSU but FSU couldn't play a B1G schedule and UF. FSU's schedule would be to tough , not UF's?

Miami would stay on the schedule simply because of South Florida recruiting.

Does FSU travel? Yes, especially if it's a quality opponent.

Minnesota is cold but Boston is not? Happy Valley is cold but not Pitt?

Is a possible schedule like this too brutal?

Troy
@ Michigan
Virginia*
@ Illinois
Miami
Ohio State
@ Maryland
Purdue
Nebraska
@ Iowa
Minnesota
@ Florida

It's tougher than the ACC but that's Big Boy Football.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:26 am 
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seanbo wrote:
The Bishin Cutter wrote:
seanbo wrote:
Why again would Florida and Miami break off?


The Big Ten's scheduling system. UMFL might be salvageable, because it's usually pretty early in the season, but UF is toast. No way in the blazes do UF, FSU, and the B1G allow that to work where it is...and no way does it sit in a non-conference portion where UMFL usually is anyway. FSU would literally play the hardest schedule every year.

Quote:
Will Duke / Pitt sell out? I know FSU-Michigan, FSU-Ohio State, FSU-Penn State, FSU-Wisconsin, and FSU-Nebraska will. ACC offers us Clemson and Virginia Tech.


Those games would sell out because the B1G schools travel, as well as show up in droves to their own home games. Can FSU travel? Do they travel well to schools only two or three states away?

Quote:
Will they travel to Minnesota and Wisconsin? Will they travel to Boston and Syracuse?


I've lived in the North Atlantic for most of my life. There is no way in the blazes it compares to what they get up in midwest. Syracuse may get a ton of lake-effect snow...Minnesota just gets SNOW...and that unforgiving Canadian dry air.

Even supposing FSU were to join...they aren't winning up in the far north very often. Michigan's rough enough...as is Happy Valley when the air starts to turn.

Quote:
Florida's 5 million plus cable subscribers aren't laughable to the Big Ten Network. Whether it's enough is another question but it would be immediately dismissed.


This I don't dismiss. But, it's the only thing I don't.


Couldn't disagree with you more.

For one, you are telling me that UF can play a full SEC schedule and FSU but FSU couldn't play a B1G schedule and UF. FSU's schedule would be to tough , not UF's?

Miami would stay on the schedule simply because of South Florida recruiting.

Does FSU travel? Yes, especially if it's a quality opponent.

Minnesota is cold but Boston is not? Happy Valley is cold but not Pitt?

Is a possible schedule like this too brutal?

Troy
@ Michigan
Virginia*
@ Illinois
Miami
Ohio State
@ Maryland
Purdue
Nebraska
@ Iowa
Minnesota
@ Florida

It's tougher than the ACC but that's Big Boy Football.


If Florida State wants to play "Big Boy Football" they should join the SEC east with Florida. They would keep Miami on the schedule, free up an OOC game because Florida would now be a conference game, and get one of the big name B-10 schools on their turf in Florida during the bowl season with out traveling north to the cold weather at the end of the college football season. If they wanted to play a few B-10 teams they would get them OOC at the beginning of the season when they have to make a return trip up north while the weather is still warm. Just don't buy Florida State to the B-10 unless the ACC is picked apart and the SEC won't take them.

_________________
SOUTH CAROLINA GAMECOCKS - SEC
RUTGERS SCARLET KNIGHTS
- BIG EAST / AMERICAN ATHLETIC CONFERENCE / BIG TEN


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 12:47 pm 
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carolinaknights wrote:
seanbo wrote:
The Bishin Cutter wrote:
seanbo wrote:
Why again would Florida and Miami break off?


The Big Ten's scheduling system. UMFL might be salvageable, because it's usually pretty early in the season, but UF is toast. No way in the blazes do UF, FSU, and the B1G allow that to work where it is...and no way does it sit in a non-conference portion where UMFL usually is anyway. FSU would literally play the hardest schedule every year.

Quote:
Will Duke / Pitt sell out? I know FSU-Michigan, FSU-Ohio State, FSU-Penn State, FSU-Wisconsin, and FSU-Nebraska will. ACC offers us Clemson and Virginia Tech.


Those games would sell out because the B1G schools travel, as well as show up in droves to their own home games. Can FSU travel? Do they travel well to schools only two or three states away?

Quote:
Will they travel to Minnesota and Wisconsin? Will they travel to Boston and Syracuse?


I've lived in the North Atlantic for most of my life. There is no way in the blazes it compares to what they get up in midwest. Syracuse may get a ton of lake-effect snow...Minnesota just gets SNOW...and that unforgiving Canadian dry air.

Even supposing FSU were to join...they aren't winning up in the far north very often. Michigan's rough enough...as is Happy Valley when the air starts to turn.

Quote:
Florida's 5 million plus cable subscribers aren't laughable to the Big Ten Network. Whether it's enough is another question but it would be immediately dismissed.


This I don't dismiss. But, it's the only thing I don't.


Couldn't disagree with you more.

For one, you are telling me that UF can play a full SEC schedule and FSU but FSU couldn't play a B1G schedule and UF. FSU's schedule would be to tough , not UF's?

Miami would stay on the schedule simply because of South Florida recruiting.

Does FSU travel? Yes, especially if it's a quality opponent.

Minnesota is cold but Boston is not? Happy Valley is cold but not Pitt?

Is a possible schedule like this too brutal?

Troy
@ Michigan
Virginia*
@ Illinois
Miami
Ohio State
@ Maryland
Purdue
Nebraska
@ Iowa
Minnesota
@ Florida

It's tougher than the ACC but that's Big Boy Football.


If Florida State wants to play "Big Boy Football" they should join the SEC east with Florida. They would keep Miami on the schedule, free up an OOC game because Florida would now be a conference game, and get one of the big name B-10 schools on their turf in Florida during the bowl season with out traveling north to the cold weather at the end of the college football season. If they wanted to play a few B-10 teams they would get them OOC at the beginning of the season when they have to make a return trip up north while the weather is still warm. Just don't buy Florida State to the B-10 unless the ACC is picked apart and the SEC won't take them.


Please ask Mike Slive to invite us. Hopefully we won't be stupid enough to turn it down again.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 8:50 am 
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seanbo wrote:
For one, you are telling me that UF can play a full SEC schedule and FSU but FSU couldn't play a B1G schedule and UF. FSU's schedule would be to tough , not UF's?


Yup, because in the SEC, rarely do you travel in the non-conference, and you get those mid- to late-season OOC body-bag games, as well as a bye week. It's the toughest conference, but it's loaded with flexibility.

In the B1G (and the PAC, to an extent), you belong to the conference from week four or five onward. You get flexibility in the SEC and ACC that you don't in the B1G. So, for FSU, you put your kids through Miami and FSU within those first four weeks, then let them play a bunch of northern midwest schools in the cooling fall? FSU's easily better than half the conference, but who's shoes would you rather be in during November in Florida: the one playing Jacksonville State or the one playing the Boilermakers?

Quote:
Minnesota is cold but Boston is not? Happy Valley is cold but not Pitt?


I can say "yes" to both of those, and what you're missing is that those might be the northernmost points on FSU's schedule. More likely, these guys are playing in Florida, North Carolina and Virginia. In the B1G, when they aren't in FSU, their next southernmost members are the likes of UMD and the Indiana schools. When they aren't in Florida, they are never really "south."

Quote:
If Florida State wants to play "Big Boy Football" they should join the SEC east with Florida. They would keep Miami on the schedule, free up an OOC game because Florida would now be a conference game, and get one of the big name B-10 schools on their turf in Florida during the bowl season with out traveling north to the cold weather at the end of the college football season. If they wanted to play a few B-10 teams they would get them OOC at the beginning of the season when they have to make a return trip up north while the weather is still warm. Just don't buy Florida State to the B-10 unless the ACC is picked apart and the SEC won't take them.


Agreed.

Part of me believes the reason FSU still isn't in the SEC has everything still to do with FSU and not the SEC.


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