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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 12:25 pm 
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tute79 wrote:
Agree JHU lacrosse geographically plugs in better with the ACC teams then hte Big ten. No doubt.

You made it sound like you were advocating JHU as a new full-member of the ACC, which is a bit over-the-top, considering JHU's athletics budget.

Also, ACC LAX is great, they don't need JHU.

Most likely the ACC is looking for an internal membership to start sponsoring the sport for their AQ.

I understand your logic Cutter but the ACC would rather have Boston College, Pitt, or GT begin sponsoring the sport to get their AQ than to allow JHU to come in a basically steal it away.

The Big Ten needed JHU for their AQ, the ACC honestly doesnt need one.

The Big Ten need a power program like JHU to help their new league, the ACC is all power programs.

I don't think the Big Ten will be too happy if JHU is winning the conference title every year over tOSU, Mich, & PSU, so in a few years we may have a different opinion of this arrangement...especially if another school like Northwestern decides to add men's LAX.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:42 pm 
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The Bishin Cutter wrote:
But even just for football...if there's a similar story about Navy making calls and them going unanswered or cut off for affiliate/partial membership, the ACC is under some pretty bad leadership. I honestly wouldn't put it past the ACC to turn that down, too.


I've heard contemplation about Navy as a partial member to the ACC for fb. One may assume it could be a part of going to 16 if the ACC decided to go there. The problem is that the ACC is hoping Notre Dame would make a full fb commitment. We've heard that scenario before in other conference situations for quiet a few years. Now, I guess the ACC could do three 5-team pods with 15 in fb if just Navy fb was added. If the ACC did that, they would still be waiting on Notre Dame for a full commitment. Such would not bode well for the hopes of UConn, Cincy, or WVU if they were able to break loose, unless the ACC was the recipient of additional extractions.

There's indication that Notre Dame is one of the big problems with the ACC trying to get a scheduling agreement with the SEC.

Including a school(s) for a minor sport(s) such as soccer or lacrosse is not uncommon among conferences. Doing such with just basketball-plus, or just football in particular, often invites problems. But Navy fb alone, could be OK. Maybe we need to see how Navy copes with the AAC if that indeed occurs. If that shows positive results, then a future transition to the ACC may be contemplated later.

We have observed the way the ACC has done things, and even understand why. But that doesn't mean their decisions are always smart. When institutional types grow in diversity, diverging priorities also can take a life of their own, and some get frustrated and look elsewhere.


Last edited by sec03 on Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:51 pm 
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No disrespect, but please, no 3-division format. Back in the inaugural season or two of C-USA, it applied that format (football not involved) and it looked like MLB-ish. I say, stick with the 2-division format and find a possible candidate to be the 16th full member.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 3:41 pm 
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Navy as a fb only would offset ND thus allowing for the ACC to add its full 16th member (likely UConn).

Likely ND/Navy would become a protected rivalry as part of this agreement.

Still that would mean Navy would have to play at least 8 ACC games (7 in division + 1 interdivision) plus ND and Army which is 11, and 12 if you add in Air Force.

So I don't think its likely.

Best we could see is Navy making a scheduling agreement with the ACC IMO.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 4:01 pm 
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Of what real value is Navy football to the ACC?
None


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 6:31 am 
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I wouldn't say none since it gets the ACC back in Maryland, and a scheduling alliance may make things easier from a scheduling standpoint, but I doubt it would pay for itself.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 8:31 am 
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tkalmus wrote:
Gemofthehills wrote:
Haven't looked at numbers but UAB probably has more research funds than any other school in Alabama.


UAB isn't geting in the ACC.

But I believe your last sentence is correct. UAB is closer to AAU status than any other university in the state of Alabama. Still they still have a long ways to go.



I agree they are not getting in or even interest but the ACC could use a presents in Alabama. If UAB had a football stadium their three big sport facilities would be good. The basketball arena is nice and the new baseball stadium maybe the best in college. The baseball stadium is shared with the minor league team.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:59 am 
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Baltimore Sun article with update on Maryland/ACC exit fee lawsuit at http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2014-0 ... conference" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 1:04 pm 
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freaked4collegefb wrote:
Baltimore Sun article with update on Maryland/ACC exit fee lawsuit at http://articles.baltimoresun.com/2014-0 ... conference" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


Of course the Maryland counter-suit, beyond the basics of building a case, has a public relations dimension to it. But it may go beyond that. Maryland may know dirt was there since they, as an ACC member, was privy to earlier ACC initiatives. And don't think the B1G has not shared with Maryland the overtures ACC representatives have made to certain B1G institutions. It's a part of discovery. Drawing in ESPN is actually a smart move. The network doesn't want to look sleazy, publically, and get entangled in the dispute. The motive on the part of Maryland by engaging the network in this is to press for a favorable settlement. ESPN will have to pay for lawyers too, and they don't want their power compromised for future dealings. If the ACC ends up embarrassing ESPN in public opinion, that could be factored in with future negotiations. Having ten or so member institutions to do some labor to gather written documents and testimony from current and past employees as part of subpoenas for discovery, put each member on notice their submissions need to be thorough and forthright or face a risk. Well, to date, Georgia Tech and Virginia Tech have apparently shared what they have, so from individual standpoints, their implied message may be that they weren't the ACC's key operatives in this. It would be interesting to see what Wake Forest, for example, shares.

The collective legal costs to Maryland, the ACC, and ESPN could surpass whatever settlement is derived.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 10:45 am 
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I don't know what happens in the future of these ACC schools should the conference fail to ever make anything close for its members as much as the B1G and SEC does for theirs, but I do know that what Maryland's doing, which is something that's for them and not their conference, will effectively shut down whatever bridges do exist between these institutions and conferences. In a sense, with Maryland doing this, were the ACC to ever "crumble," you can expect those chaser programs to march right to the SEC. There is no way they will work with Maryland again in any kind of capacity.

I really hope it's worth it for the Big Ten having this school with its current administration...which pretty much shut out all reason and accountability with its student body, alumni base, and fans.

ctx48c wrote:
Of what real value is Navy football to the ACC?
None

wbyeager wrote:
I wouldn't say none since it gets the ACC back in Maryland, and a scheduling alliance may make things easier from a scheduling standpoint, but I doubt it would pay for itself.


Yup, it's only about getting back into Maryland. I know people will say that the ACC will still have its media reach into the area, but without a school for the region to focus on (and it won't just start being UVA or VPI), who's going to care? It's hardly a market. It's kind of like having Big XII games on basic cable in PA...nice to have it, but who's watching it?


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2014 6:08 pm 
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Here's a post (Clay Travis, March 25, 2014, Fox Sports) with a perspective on the lawsuit involving the ACC and Maryland: The ACC and Maryland's Lawsuit is Getting Nasty.

http://msn.foxsports.com/college-footba ... -nasty.php

The ACC fears compromising on the lawsuit as it may mean other members could leave in the not so distant future. Yet, continuing with the lawsuit, some more embarrassing revelations shall get disclosed.

Travis appears to view the unprecedented exit fee and newly imposed GoRs' are not as iron clad as interests of certain conferences have advocated.
----------------------
Some earlier tidbits not mentioned in the above. GT, VPI, and NCSU are cooperating with Maryland's discovery request. I have not heard about the others' intent.

GT is frequently in the rumor mill about the B1G's allegedly pursuit of them along with UVA. VPI and NC (or maybe NCSU) as potential SEC targets have never really gone away. Perhaps showing patience and silence until the opportunity arises. Prep-work may be ongoing below the radar.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 6:38 pm 
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There's some stuff out there speculating about which schools from the ACC may still be interested in or targets for the B1G or the SEC. There's those tweets up WV way (rumors with agendas) and elsewhere. They go along the line UVA is no longer interested in the B1G (of course, UVA may never have been unless they expected the ACC to implode). Then there are the commentaries that VPI wants to stay with the ACC and would not seek to be a part of the SEC. FSU is now happy, and GT is not planning to pursue a move either (no to B1G with UVA).
The claim is that the only ACC school open to moving would be NC State to the SEC. Then there are comments NCSU would not have to gain approval---apparently from the system's governing board. So, the message goes, the SEC has identified their future #15th, but nothing beyond that from the ACC.

Looking at this realistically, it could be plausible NCSU may be open to SEC consideration and it would fit a major SEC objective to have a prime school in NC. Accepting that the idea has developing merit, the timing would have to be futuristic in terms of years. I don't buy the thought that the opportunity arises in the immediate aftermath of the ACC vs Maryland lawsuit being settled, which is based on exit fee contention rather than a GoR. And even if the SEC clearly had a path to a desired #15, the conference would also want to have available and desirable #16th, assuming possibly outside the ACC. All this would be on top of a new mood to embark on another expansion.

As to UNC system governing board of which NCSU is one of their entities, the body certainly would have a role to sign-off on any member moving. If any unnamed source is actually real to claim otherwise in this regard, such source (perhaps implied from the assistant coaching ranks) would be mistaken.

Other factors that would impact such as decision would be the power 5 conferences gaining more autonomy that somehow would yield GoR compromising or generate a school or group of schools and a host conference to challenge a given GoR. As noted in an earlier post, perhaps some future scheduling agreements lead to some compromising on expansion/re-alignment among the power 5 conferences. And when a conference is up for TV broadcasting negotiations, does impact.

If the divide (among the power conferences) in conference revenues grow, even with the ACC pursing a future conference network, then movement could
happen at some point. I do believe 16-team conferences are goals with at least three among the power 5.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:38 am 
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FSU and Clemson's happiness will ebb and flow like the tides. The news about deregulating the CCG participation qualifications go a long way to ensure some theoretical contentment, but I'm not convinced that this goes over extremely well the more often the "name brand" football schools get their spot in these games over schools who wouldn't draw as well or don't factor into the CFP.

FSU lost its administrative ACC apologist, and I doubt the faculty will sway the boosters and other administrators who know the SEC will fetch them everything they always thought they were worth. The ACC needs a network, like, yesterday.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:51 am 
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The Bishin Cutter wrote:
FSU lost its administrative ACC apologist, and I doubt the faculty will sway the boosters and other administrators who know the SEC will fetch them everything they always thought they were worth. The ACC needs a network, like, yesterday.

Correct me if I'm wrong but, I thought the ACC sold all of its 3rd party rights to ESPN when they renegotiated their contract a few years back.

IMO ESPN doesn't want another channel (its still rolling out the LHN and the SECN) and even if they did start one for the ACC I'm not sure how the ACC expects any money from said channel (unless ESPN said if we make a channel we can renegotiate, then I really dont understand why ESPN would do it) when it no longer owns its rights (ESPN bought UT and the SEC's separate from their other TV deal's for 1st/2nd tier rights).

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:18 am 
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tkalmus wrote:
The Bishin Cutter wrote:
FSU lost its administrative ACC apologist, and I doubt the faculty will sway the boosters and other administrators who know the SEC will fetch them everything they always thought they were worth. The ACC needs a network, like, yesterday.

Correct me if I'm wrong but, I thought the ACC sold all of its 3rd party rights to ESPN when they renegotiated their contract a few years back.

IMO ESPN doesn't want another channel (its still rolling out the LHN and the SECN) and even if they did start one for the ACC I'm not sure how the ACC expects any money from said channel (unless ESPN said if we make a channel we can renegotiate, then I really dont understand why ESPN would do it) when it no longer owns its rights (ESPN bought UT and the SEC's separate from their other TV deal's for 1st/2nd tier rights).


This makes sense in terms of the direction matters are heading with TV contracts involving ESPN. Since ESPN is the prime broadcaster involving both the SEC and ACC, ESPN's power only grows. Maryland intensely points to it with their efforts to reach a monetary settlement with the ACC. ESPN doesn't really deny it, they just don't want to be tarnished publically in how they exert their major influence in impacting expansion/re-alignment.

There could be a point when ESPN gains such a level of control over conferences in their 'pack', they could essentially dictate movement using the purse. Hypothetically, ESPN tells the SEC we'll get you NCSU and 'up' the Charlotte and Raleigh area markets and venues; then convey to the ACC "best to let NCSU go to the SEC, and we urge you to add UConn to replace and further promote your bb brand and help counter what the B1G may be trying to do further in the NE".

As to Texas and the LHN, ESPN may see it as more of an investment rather than an immediate huge profit for ESPN itself. ESPN is certainly not reversing on it given the efforts with Dish TV. In this regard, ESPN shall have growing influence with future Longhorn decisions and Texas knows it and embraces it because the goals remain mutual for now. Corporate power is at work and ESPN is in the game for maximizing profits.

When the old BE rejected ESPN's contract offer several years back, that accelerated the BE breakup. At that point, ESPN wanted it to happen and it did.


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