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PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2003 9:40 am 
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In response to Mooseheadcane's last post on the "BCS conferences need to take a stand" thread, I've created this thread to discuss all possible rumors about ND joining the BE FB conference.

Feel free to share any thoughts and/or any information you might have on this topic. 8-)


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2003 3:57 pm 
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Not likely. They gain nothing from joining the Big East, or any other conference as long as the football powers that be, and the tv networks keep letting them have their own way.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2003 7:31 pm 
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Bowl deals and not TV contracts will determine if Notre Dame joins a conference. The Big East will most likly not include Notre Dame when the Big East Bowl deals are renewed in 2006 unless the football team joins the conference.

If the Gator Bowl and NBC want Notre Dame every year, let them. What happens if Notre Dame ever gets invited to the BCS again. Not worth the risk and what bowl would not want the second place team in the fast rising Big East football conference.

Will the BCS include Notre Dame when the contract is renewed in 2006? not sure. ABC would benefit if Notre Dame joined the Big 10 or Big East and ABC will do everything to keep the BCS.

The bottom line is Notre Dame can't go it alone any more. The question should not be will Notre Dame join a conference for football, however, which conference will Notre Dame join? The Big East makes the most sense. Could 2006 be the year?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 13, 2003 9:12 pm 
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I am of the opinion that Notre Dame will be stuck between a rock *being the BIG 10* and a hard place *the Big East*. They will be forced if not by ABC to join a conference then by these two conferences themselves. Notre Dame will probably never suffer from a lack of money for football but a few years without the shot at a BCS money game may make them balk. I believe that after what happened to the Big East this year with the Gator Bowl and how the Big 10 threw its weight around to get Iowa into that second BCS spot was pivotal. Notre Dame I believe will no longer get hand outs from any conference. As someone on another message board stated a few days ago The Days of independence is over for EVERYONE including Notre Dame.


Last edited by cyc46 on Thu Feb 13, 2003 9:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 10:03 am 
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geographically the B-10 makes the most sense.
culturally being a roman catholic school it fits better
into the BE. which ever conf. they may join, i'm sure
they will be kicking and fighting the whole way not to
join. i would'nt surprise me if the try and make the
transition over 8-10 years by first starting to play 3
teams in a conf. and then increasing 1 by every couple
of years or so. they would'nt get away with that in the
B-10, but it might be possible in the BE.

the other possibility would be for ND to join the ACC.
i believe that they have scheduled several games with
the ACC down the road. don't know if that is a clue
or not.

if ND joins the BE, the next question would be, who
follows them into the BE? there seems to be a lot
of discussion about 12 team BCS conferences. i believe
12 or even 14 team conferences are the best way to go.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2003 2:02 pm 
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mooseheadcane, not sure about ND scheduling of ACC teams. An interesting point to the 2006 or 2007 ND schedule includes four Big 10 teams (Penn State, Mich, Mich State, Purdue). Everyone thinks this is business as usual and ND has always played these teams. Agreed, however, don't remember ND having four teams from the same conference on the schedule the same year.
Do you think that ND will be included in the Big East bowl deals are renewed in 2006?

My opinion is that if ND want so share in the Big East bowl deals after 2006, they should have to play Miami as a 2 for 1. This time 2 games in Miami for a one time return to south Bend or else no minor BE bowl deals.



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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 10:25 am 
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lash - the BE can stand on it's on now and does not
need ND as it may have in the past, so i doubt the BE
will give them a free pass to their bowl deals after 2005.
if "trained geese" entertains the idea, then i think that
he's history. i think that WVA, PITT, VT and MIAMI would
have an awful lot to say about it.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:53 pm 
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It seems to me that Norte Dame will have to be both a basketball and football member in the Big East by 2006 or be out of the Big East period! Why should Notre Dame receive special privilge anyway!


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2003 11:07 am 
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Success on the field will be a big factor too. I like Willingham alot, but if they lose an extra game or two next year, they may be forced to appease the BE or go ahead and decide on entering the Big 10. I think they're better off in the BE, sine they'd probably never struggle too much, and they'd have more flexibility in OOC scheduling. If they enter the Big 10 during a down year, they may never recover.

Once ND does make its intentions known, I'm stillnot sure the BE might not lose Pitt. I think the Big 10 is still more likely to throw PSU a bone (Pitt) than Iowa (Missouri or Iowa St.). Especially if Pitt conitnues the hoops success and manages to upset Miami in football this year. That being said, others on the board have made solid arguments against Pitt as well.

the uncertainty surrounding the BE probably hurts the conference, since if ND was definitely gonna move in, they could probably raid other conferences for top schools as well. The ACC would even have to be worried about FSU, and the Big 10 would definitely be a tad concerned about PSU.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 18, 2003 11:57 am 
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ACCNole2,

My comment on the BE expansion thread about the BE cherry picking the ACC can work both ways. There seems to be friction between the BB and FB schools in both conferences. One possibility would be for the FB schools in both conferences splitting of and creating 1 super conference with ND and possibly Penn ST as well.

This new conference would probably get an at large bid every year, but there would be 1 less automatic bid since neither the ACC or BE would qualify without the power FB teams.

This could lead to the Southern Ivy/Magnolia conference from what is left in the south, or a new BB conference that combines what if left from both conferences. Fun speculation, but it probably belongs on either dream or Ivy thread.

FBfan



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PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2003 3:57 pm 
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Reading between the lines suggest that Notre Dame football will be joining the BE in the very near future. Possibly as soon as the conference scaps the two division mens basketball format requiring every team play a regular season mens basketball game. Every division 1 basketball member plays a regular season game and every BE member playing division 1 football play a regular season game. Makes sense and sets the stage for the upcomming contract and bowl negotations in a couple years.

Continuity is going to be very good for the conference for both basketball and football.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 22, 2003 11:46 am 
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I don't believe that Notre Dame joins the BE unless the BCS forces them to. As long as Notre Dame has their TV contract, they will be able to get someone to play them. However, if the other BCS teams refuse to schedule them, or simply vote them out (for noncomplience), then Notre Dame will continue on the merry independent way.

By 2005, it is possible that ND receives an ultimatum to join a conference. If they are forced, I believe that they would pick the Big East over the Big 10.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 10:24 am 
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I think for ND it's BE or nothing. Unless Willingham pulls off an undefeated season (a possibility, but lot's of first year coaches have success then fail to recruit) I think ND will reluctantly consider the security provided by joining a conference. If the BE brings in a couple of existing rivals in the meantime, it'll make the decision even easier. Navy seems like a no-brainer. Not so sure about Army. Louisville would provide a nice metro area and success in both sports.

Does anyone know how ND feels about Louisville? Maybe not so hot now with Pitino there, but aren't they at least potential rivals? I don;t mean like USC/ND, but itsn't there some appeal to the match-up? Maybe that's just basketball, since historically you've had those UK vs. Lousiville vs. Indiana vs. ND mini-tourneys.

Whatever the BE does, I hope they leave room for PSU.

FBfan, I think it'll take time for things to heat up, but if the football faction in the ACC sits back and watches the BE add ND while they do nothing, things will get interesting. It'll take serious discontent for FSU to leave, but if the right inducement is there (joining the BE with Miami, ND, and some old Metro conf teams), anything is possible. If Clemson jumps ship and we're stuck in the ACC foundering with a crappy replacement for Bowden I'll probably have my head in an oven.

Whatever the BE does, I'd ensure that they add at least one major basketball power (just in case there is a split with some of the hoops-only schools), and do anything they can to lure in ND.

Move to 9 and beef up hoops---Louisville
Recruit ND and round off at 10---Navy
Add another member to recruit Penn State---ND
Finish off at 12 members---PSU

As far as the ACC goes, I wonder what they'll do if the BE is already at 12 before teams like Clemson and FSU seriously consider moving on. I think the BE would be desperate for them to join, but what could they really do?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 4:33 pm 
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I'm with JFin on this one.
ND does NOTHING unless forced. They have everything their own way as an independent. The idiots of the Big East have even given them one of their top Bowl spots. The West Va. coach was right in being upset about that last year.

NBC re-ups the Notre Dame contract and they have their own TV station, and split revenue with nobody, and get a Bowl berth if they qualify. Why give that up? It's like having a wife and girlfriend, and not only do they both get along, but they also work together to support you.

It will be up to the BCS to MAKE THEM. The first salvo was fired this year when the Pac-10 and Big-10 got together and were able to exclude Notre Dame from the BCS equation. If this keeps happening, and the BigEast gets smart and pulls the plug, then Notre Dame will be forced into joining a conference.

WHEN THIS HAPPENS ;D AND IT WILL, Notre Dame will join the Big East. They are already there in every other sport and they like it. The Big 10 then will FINALLY give up on them, and look elsewhere for team #12. The Big-10 (11?) should do this right now, but seem to still be holding out for ND. This will potentially trigger a domino movement of schools, if the Big 10 raids either the Big East or Big XII.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 27, 2003 8:20 pm 
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A tad off subject, but here's where I really get frustrated w/ ND fans:
Check out this post from www.insidetheville.com


Quote:

Why should ND join a conference??? They play one of the top schedules year in and year out, the reason Navy plays them close every year is due to the fact that they are "rivals". They have a good history with each other which is why they are considered to be rivals. Back to the conf. thing... they rake in enough cash already! No one could count how many rich alumni that institution has to fork up the dough for them. No need to be throwing in "YOU" during your little (griping) just because your poor little Mountaineers blow.

I had to sensor the post somewhat, because there was some profanity. We haven't had a problem with that yet, and we don't need to start. :)
Anyway, half of my family grew up ND fans. I used to follow the Irish awhile myself, until they completely fell apart under Davie, who has thankfully been fired. ND football can be nice to watch, but I do think it is past time for ND to be in a conference. FYI, I do not think ND played one of the best schedules this year. I'd prefer to give that honor to teams like USC, Miami, FSU, or even (gag) Auburn. Let's not forget that NBC is the same network that has lost both the NFL and the NBA, and is now looking to televise Arena Football. ::)
Wow, what fun. ::) NBC needs to get on the ball, and snatch a conference like the Big East or the Big 12 or even CUSA from ABC/ESPN and televise them, but they continue to televise only the Irish. ND's uppity attitude is something else also, and I will rejoice when the BCS finally forces them into the Big East against their will. ;D
Even if ND could blow out WVU, I'm pretty sure Auburn, Alabama, and my Georgia Dawgs could top ND.


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