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PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2010 7:20 pm 
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Of course nothing is done.But according to commennts made by Missouri officials and freedom of the press requests in Missouri and stories in Nebraska papers the likelihood of both these schools is high as part of the first wave of moves.This is also political for the western B10 schools.

Of course Rutgers brings in the NYC #1 USA tv market and is also highly likely in the first move at 14.

With regard to ND ,I believe it does want to give up its independence.Thus the likelihood of 16 is less than 14

I really do not think that B10 wants to deal with non-AAU school at the same time as they are dealing with ND another non-AAU school.
The ranking of the other BE football schools is as follows 1.Pitt(ND plays home and home with them,the only school in the BE),of course Pitt is a public AAU school with a large research budget
.2Syracuse a private AAU school with a much smaller research budget
3 BC a private non-AAU school with a small research budget.


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PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2010 7:25 pm 
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I think ND will say no for now and they add Nebraska, Missouri, Rutgers. If in a couple of years ND doesn't like the BE with UCF in it or a split where they stay with the bball schools, then yeah they'll go. If the B10 really wanted ND they would take Syracuse, Pitt, Rutgers, UConn, to force ND's hand.

the ncaabbs board brought up an interesting view about ND. Saying that ND is in the midwest and has that area covered. It would be better for them to go to the ACC because that gets them in the southeast. They have the midwest, they have a CA ties by playing USC & Stanford, currently are strong in the east. To ND money seems to be lower on the list than pride. No night home games. Don't mess with our schedule, if we get a BCS game(I know but they still think they're top 10) we get to keep all 17 mill instead of sharing with 15 members.

We shall see if they have the balls to turn down the B10 again.

ctx I think you meant that ND wants to STAY Indy.

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PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2010 10:14 pm 
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ctx48c wrote:
Of course nothing is done.But according to commennts made by Missouri officials and freedom of the press requests in Missouri and stories in Nebraska papers the likelihood of both these schools is high as part of the first wave of moves.This is also political for the western B10 schools.

Of course Rutgers brings in the NYC #1 USA tv market and is also highly likely in the first move at 14.

With regard to ND ,I believe it does want to give up its independence.Thus the likelihood of 16 is less than 14

I really do not think that B10 wants to deal with non-AAU school at the same time as they are dealing with ND another non-AAU school.
The ranking of the other BE football schools is as follows 1.Pitt(ND plays home and home with them,the only school in the BE),of course Pitt is a public AAU school with a large research budget
.2Syracuse a private AAU school with a much smaller research budget
3 BC a private non-AAU school with a small research budget.


If we learned one thing from the ACC expansion, it's that things will not go as planned & that there will be surprises. Expect the unexpected.


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PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2010 10:49 pm 
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friar, what's your surprise? That ND joins? It would count I think. So would going to 16 w/o ND. Big surprise... like taking Kansas or Vanderbilt or Texas and Texas A&M?

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PostPosted: Mon May 17, 2010 11:18 pm 
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I don't know if freaked posted this somewhere. Dodd says that ND's schedule shows that they'll stay Indy unless they plan on dropping USC and Navy off the schedule. He also says w/o ND and Texas the whole thing is a bluff. I said on the ncabbs board it won't be a bluff. All the other conferences would black ball the B10 by not scheduling them for being f'd with. Also there is too much money to be made by adding members and a title game.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootbal ... ent-future

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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2010 8:55 am 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
friar, what's your surprise? That ND joins? It would count I think. So would going to 16 w/o ND. Big surprise... like taking Kansas or Vanderbilt or Texas and Texas A&M?


If we knew what it was, it wouldn't be a surprise, would it?

The point is that everyone thought that Miami, BC, & Syracuse were a done deal to the ACC at this point in 2003. A month later it was only Miami & Virginia Tech who were added. No one saw that coming. Heck, in May of 2003, Virginia Tech was lobbying all the Big East schools to make a pledge to stick together.

Right now everyone thinks that Missouri, Nebraska, & Rutgers are a done deal with ND likely to stay indy. So, I guess any change from that would be a surprise. So would a turnabout by Texas. I guess no Big East teams would also be considered a surprise. But who knows what else might turn up?


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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2010 11:48 am 
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ctx48c wrote:
Of course nothing is done.But according to commennts made by Missouri officials and freedom of the press requests in Missouri and stories in Nebraska papers the likelihood of both these schools is high as part of the first wave of moves.This is also political for the western B10 schools.

Of course Rutgers brings in the NYC #1 USA tv market and is also highly likely in the first move at 14.

With regard to ND ,I believe it does want to give up its independence.Thus the likelihood of 16 is less than 14

I really do not think that B10 wants to deal with non-AAU school at the same time as they are dealing with ND another non-AAU school.
The ranking of the other BE football schools is as follows 1.Pitt(ND plays home and home with them,the only school in the BE),of course Pitt is a public AAU school with a large research budget
.2Syracuse a private AAU school with a much smaller research budget
3 BC a private non-AAU school with a small research budget.



CTX, you'll be happy to know that during the Big Ten meetings, the Iowa AD made mention to many of the demographic facts of the conference and how many of the members in the current B10 footprint (and rest of the country) are leaving for the Sun Belt. He also mentions that the alumni base in the Rust Belt remains solid though. But it is a public comment that can at least lead one to believe that at least 1 person is bringing up the "south" as an expansion option. However, this likely is an endorsement for trying harder to get Texas and Texas A&M. But the same could be said for Maryland, Vanderbilt, etc as southern schools.

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PostPosted: Tue May 18, 2010 11:53 am 
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friarfan wrote:

Right now everyone thinks that Missouri, Nebraska, & Rutgers are a done deal with ND likely to stay indy. So, I guess any change from that would be a surprise. So would a turnabout by Texas. I guess no Big East teams would also be considered a surprise. But who knows what else might turn up?


I also think that the issues with the ACC expansion serve as a reference for the Big Ten to avoid. Each round of expansion is a learning experience. I do think that the Big Ten will put a lot of time into expansion to make sure it goes as planned. In other words, I think the presidents will have all the votes needed for every scenario before extending formal invites...and will also know who will except at that point. Granted, the Big Ten also has the financial benefit where they will be approaching schools making $4 million a year from the BE or $8-$10 in the Big 12 and offering them $22 million per year. the ACC wasn't offering the Big East schools such a huge bump.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 9:31 am 
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Article out of St Louis with comments from Lou Holtz regarding possibility of ND joining the Big Ten.Article discusses Big Ten and ND athletic revenues.Link at http://www.stltoday.com/sports/college/ ... d7038.html


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 9:51 am 
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Article out of Columbus with comments from ND AD regarding changing college landscape and Notre Dame's independent place in it at http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sp ... t-can.html


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:45 am 
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ND and BYU are problematic situations for some different reasons.
If the BE expands to 12 fb and/or splits; and the B12 also adds two eventually, all BCS conferences would be at 12. The willingness of the B10 to go beyond 12 may not be open-ended indefinitely. ND's overall lure, may diminish a little bit each year, particularly if fb struggles continue. That focuses on their independent TV contract with NBC. If another network picks it up, it may not be as desirable as ND would hope. The point is ND's options may narrow, and they could have passed-up opportunities that were in their best interest for the long-term. As long as the BE gives ND fully what they want, ND is not budging.
BYU is hoping for a B12 invitation. Their move to independence was reactionary to the PAC10 inviting Utah. While the MWC TV contract was sub-standard in their view, BYU's attraction to sustain itself as an independent may have challenges. Their appeal is largely regional, and they could encounter scheduling complications down the road. They did not make profile gains in how they placed their non-fb sports in the BWC. Plus, the BCS has not offered BYU a special avenue to BCS bowls as available to ND.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:28 pm 
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louisvillecard01 wrote:
ND and BYU are problematic situations for some different reasons.
If the BE expands to 12 fb and/or splits; and the B12 also adds two eventually, all BCS conferences would be at 12. The willingness of the B10 to go beyond 12 may not be open-ended indefinitely. ND's overall lure, may diminish a little bit each year, particularly if fb struggles continue. That focuses on their independent TV contract with NBC. If another network picks it up, it may not be as desirable as ND would hope. The point is ND's options may narrow, and they could have passed-up opportunities that were in their best interest for the long-term. As long as the BE gives ND fully what they want, ND is not budging.
BYU is hoping for a B12 invitation. Their move to independence was reactionary to the PAC10 inviting Utah. While the MWC TV contract was sub-standard in their view, BYU's attraction to sustain itself as an independent may have challenges. Their appeal is largely regional, and they could encounter scheduling complications down the road. They did not make profile gains in how they placed their non-fb sports in the BWC. Plus, the BCS has not offered BYU a special avenue to BCS bowls as available to ND.


I was thinking about the B12 yesterday as well. It might seem like a stretch, but I was thinking that if they did expand to 12, a new line of thought might be to go west with both schools. At some point, the success at Boise St. could come into play with a BCS conference. And looking at the footprint, adding BYU and nearby Boise St. as the 12th might not be too much of a stretch. BSU might make sense if BYU is in the mix...more so than say, BYU and Louisville or BYU and another Texas school (TCU).

Meanwhile, ND will always have the Big Ten option. And really, they might be fine at 13 with Nebraska and ND.

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PostPosted: Tue Nov 02, 2010 3:42 pm 
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Could be.

BYU seems like a perrenially strong team, but that Sunday-Sabbath issue might be seen as problematic by some.

Boise has done very well for a while now. Can they sustain it ? Boise is not a huge market, and I think they are currently pushing the stadium to about 30,000 (huge compared to the population of the metro Boise area, but really not so big relative to the Big XII). Their staying power (especially after the end of the Chris Peterson regime) is the question.

I think a lot of teams in the Big XII have had super seasons thwarted in the Conference Championship Game. Nebraska (losing he first one to A&M ?), Oklahoma (losing to Kansas State), Missouri going 11-2 and losing twice to OU (and dropping quickly from #1 to the non-BCS Cotton Bowl). I think the round-robin really suits these teams, in that it removes the possibilities of re-match or CCG major upset. There may be external pressure to go to 12 and a CCG, should the BE does the same, and should that become the standard for a BCS auto-bid conference.

Then geography would come into play. I think past experience (and perception that the Oklahoma and Texas schools will be strongest in any given year) would dictate that OU and OSU HAVE TO BE in a separate division from the 4 Texas schools. So does this influence who the conference expands with ?
Maybe....


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 3:09 pm 
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louisvillecard01 wrote:
ND and BYU are problematic situations for some different reasons.
If the BE expands to 12 fb and/or splits; and the B12 also adds two eventually, all BCS conferences would be at 12. The willingness of the B10 to go beyond 12 may not be open-ended indefinitely. ND's overall lure, may diminish a little bit each year, particularly if fb struggles continue. That focuses on their independent TV contract with NBC. If another network picks it up, it may not be as desirable as ND would hope. The point is ND's options may narrow, and they could have passed-up opportunities that were in their best interest for the long-term. As long as the BE gives ND fully what they want, ND is not budging.
BYU is hoping for a B12 invitation. Their move to independence was reactionary to the PAC10 inviting Utah. While the MWC TV contract was sub-standard in their view, BYU's attraction to sustain itself as an independent may have challenges. Their appeal is largely regional, and they could encounter scheduling complications down the road. They did not make profile gains in how they placed their non-fb sports in the BWC. Plus, the BCS has not offered BYU a special avenue to BCS bowls as available to ND.


BYU went to the WCC, not the BWC. The WCC TV package is up next year and they just doubled their marquee games. It's quite plausible that the WCC TV deal matches what BYU got in the MWC thanks to the power of Gonzaga and the unique time slots that the WCC fills for ESPN.

Which means BYU is already coming out ahead thanks to their FB TV deal with ESPN. Anything they get from the BYU Network is just a bonus.

With regard to scheduling, the WAC sitting at six teams basically gives them ample open dates, and ESPN is going to help them because its in their best interest to put good BYU match-ups on TV.

Notre Dame is in a situation where their lack of success, combined with the other conferences new TV deals, has lowered the gap between their revenue and everyone elses. Back in the day, they had the most TV time and largest TV revenue. Now the Big Ten and SEC pummel that, as does Texas.

Notre Dame is in a situation where they may need to give up independence to keep up with the BCS schools.
BYU is in a situation where they had little revenue, and independence helps them pull away from the non-BCS schools.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 04, 2010 10:16 am 
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tute79 wrote:
Could be.

BYU seems like a perrenially strong team, but that Sunday-Sabbath issue might be seen as problematic by some.

Boise has done very well for a while now. Can they sustain it ? Boise is not a huge market, and I think they are currently pushing the stadium to about 30,000 (huge compared to the population of the metro Boise area, but really not so big relative to the Big XII). Their staying power (especially after the end of the Chris Peterson regime) is the question.

I think a lot of teams in the Big XII have had super seasons thwarted in the Conference Championship Game. Nebraska (losing he first one to A&M ?), Oklahoma (losing to Kansas State), Missouri going 11-2 and losing twice to OU (and dropping quickly from #1 to the non-BCS Cotton Bowl). I think the round-robin really suits these teams, in that it removes the possibilities of re-match or CCG major upset. There may be external pressure to go to 12 and a CCG, should the BE does the same, and should that become the standard for a BCS auto-bid conference.

Then geography would come into play. I think past experience (and perception that the Oklahoma and Texas schools will be strongest in any given year) would dictate that OU and OSU HAVE TO BE in a separate division from the 4 Texas schools. So does this influence who the conference expands with ?
Maybe....


Let's not forget that it was not Chris Peterson who created the current Boise State juggernaut. It was Dan Hawkins, currently the head coach at Colorado. Boise State has already sustained its success under 2 different head coaches.


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