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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:35 pm 

Quote:
also, i agree with what you said about the public socon schools having unrealistic expectations. i know that they were probably not to happy with elon coming in in the first place, but who did they want, as i feel you guys were really one of the best options.

there really isnt that much out there anymore thats not private unless you want to expand the conferences footprint.

also, this is offtopic, but do you know why etsu chose the atlantic sun over the ovc? was the ovc an option or was the asun the last resort?



Once they dropped football, ETSU lost any chance it might have had of getting into the OVC. The OVC requires all member schools to sponsor football - but it doesn't require them to compete for the league title. That's why Morehead St. & Austin Peay can sponsor non-scholarship football & compete in the Pioneer League in that sport, but still play in the OVC for all other sports. If they ever get back to offering scholarships, Morehead & APSU will be welcomed to compete in FB again, but if they drop the sport completely they will be forced to leave the league.

Moving to the Big South would be a big drop down for ETSU. Moving to the A-Sun is only a minor step down, and affords them the chance to compete with other Tennessee schools like Belmont & David Lipscomb.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 1:54 pm 

Quote:
because the asun is losing troy st. and ucf next year and fau is leaving soon too.

if im not mistaken, the rule is 6 teams together for at least 5 years.

that leaves
ga st.
jacksonville
stetson
mercer
cambell

as the only schools who have been there for five years or more. belmont wont have 5 continuous years till 2006. so if fau leave the asun before 2006, they lose their automatic bid. i think they are fighting to keep fau so it might not happen but it is a strong possibility.


Troy State joins the SunBelt for football in 2004, but doesn't join for basketball until 2005-06; FAU joins the SBC for football in 2005, but doesn't join for basketball until 2006-07; UCF leaves the A-Sun for all-sports in CUSA in 2005-06.

The remaining A-Sun members for 2005-06 will be:
Mercer*
Georgia St.*
Belmont+
Stetson*
Jacksonville*
FAU*#
Gardner-Webb
Campbell*
Lipscomb
ETSU^
*= currently meets 6 team/5 year rule
+= meets 6 team/5 year rule next season
#= leaves league the following season
^= will be first year in league.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 2:36 pm 

Quote:
Now that it has been announced that east tennesse state is leaving the socon for the atlantic sun due to dropping their basketball program, who is the likely candidate to replace them? It has been stated by socon officials that they would like a school that played football. with that i will list some options for them.

any big south football playing school.

these include:

gardner webb- in big south for football only and is relaively new to d-1 in general. privated school located in boiling springs, north carolina

coastal carolina- in big south for all sports and is a PUBLIC school located in conway, sc. first year for football and is surprsingly somewhat competitive.

vmi- just left socon for big south in a "trade" for elon. located in lexingon, virginia a public military academy

liberty- private christian school located in lynchburg va. stable member of big south for a couple of years now.

charleston southern- like liberty expect not religious. located in charleston, sc.

these are pretty much their only options as i doubt any southern a-10 school like james madision or william and mary would leave the caa to join socon for allsports. so my pick for a football playing school to join would be either coastal carolina or gardner webb. liberty and vmi are too far north, plus vmi just got kicked out and they dont need two schools in charleston so charleston southern is out.

now if they would not mind settling for a non football school, then their options expand tremendously to include

unc ashville-public
birmingham southern-private
winthrop-public
radford-public
high point-private
campbell-private
georgia st.- public
uncw, a public school, might consider joining to get in a group with instate rivals though i really doubt that would happen as they are extremely content in the caa

there really isnt that much to chose from outside of the big south especially if they want a football school, which they probably will get considering they just got rid of a school for dropping football.

Final Answer- Coastal Carolina
a full member of the big south, this school just seems more desirable compared to gardner webb which is not even a full member of the big south. coastal carolina looks to be the best choice

this leaves the socon with a 8-4 public-private school ratio, a big issue within the socon now. i guess we will have to wait and see how it all turns out.


Charleston Southern is like Liberty but not religious? Says who? Or didn't you know that Charleston Southern's previous name was Baptist College?

At any rate, I don't see the SoCon being interested in any of the current Big South members, with the possible exception of Gardner-Webb (and they are only an associate member since the rest of their sports are in the A-Sun). This is only because GWU has a familiarity with the SoCon due to scheduling a number of their members in various sports over the years, and they are the only current Big South school that might be able to be competitive in football.

Most of the Kentucky & Tennessee members of the OVC are a pretty tight-knit group, and not too likely to be pulled away into the SoCon; but newer teams like Jacksonville St. & Samford (another Baptist school) might be more easily swayed. TN Tech would still be a remote possibility, but I wouldn't count on Eastern KY.

With ETSU's departure, the SoCon would look like this:
Appalachian St.
Davidson*
W.Carolina
UNC-Greensboro*#
College of Charleston*#
UT-Chattanooga
GA Southern
Wofford
Furman
The Citadel
Elon
* = non-FB school
# = rumored to be leaving.

UNCG & CC departing for leagues that lean more towards basketball than football would not be too surprising, but I would think Charleston would be a better fit in the Atlantic Sun than the Colonial.

If both the above schools leave, that would leave the league with 8 FB schools & 1 non-FB school. The SoCon could function just fine in this way, but would probably look to add one more team to give the odd team a travel partner. There are too many possibilities to do much more than speculate at this time, but if only one team is added, look for it to be either Gardner-Webb, Jacksonville St., or Hampton U., with TN Tech a slight possibility.

If more than one team is added, then the following schools could be added to the above mix: Georgia St., Samford, NC A&T, Richmond, and possibly William & Mary (the last two were long-time members at one point).





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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 7:50 pm 
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thanks for your info about the ovc, as im not too familiar with them. however, if you looked at one of my others posts, my opinion of them was the same as yours, and i doubted that anyone would want to join the socon therefore increasing travel costs and losing such close rivals.

etsu fans are not too happy with the move to the atlantic sun, because that conference is losing some of its best schools. after the florida schools and troy st. leaves, the only public schools left will be georgia st. and etsu. the rest will be small religous/liberal arts schools. i dont know how excited etsu fans are about getting the opportunity to play local religious/liberal arts schools.

no i didnt know the previous name for charleston southern, i just looked on the collegeboard.com and it said that charelston southern was liberal arts, not religous, so i went with that. i doubt the socon would want gardner webb due to some scandal ive read about on these boards. im not too informed about that situation however.

college of charleston would be miserable in the atlantic sun, imo, especially after all the big public schools leave. they should stay in the socon or make the jump to the caa, one of the most competitive mid majors, the atlantic sun would be a step down to me. traveling in the caa would be miserable for coc, but competition in the asun wouldnt be that great.

finally, a richmond or a william and mary move to the socon would be incredibly shocking.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 8:13 am 
You wanted an update. OUt of the Southern Conference championship, you heard two school names being mentioned for ETSU replacements: Hampton and Eastern Kentucky.

The Georgia State name keeps rolling around too.

So like I said on the CAA thread. Screw CAA expansion and pull UNCW to the SoCon:

North Division:
Eastern Kentucky
Appalachian St
UT-Chattanooga
Western Carolina
UNCG
Elon
Davidson

South Division:
UNCW
College of Charleston
The Citadel
Wofford
Furman
Georgia Southern
Georgia State

You'd end up with Davidson, Georgia St, UNCW, CoC, UTC, Georgia Southern being top 140 teams ...


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 5:49 pm 
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put uncw with the nc schools. why would they leave the caa, a conference where they will end up being in a division full of va schools, to be in the socon where they will end up being in a division w/ sc schools. if that is going to happen, we are better off in the caa, because i still say that even if unh and northeastern are the ones that are added, the caa will still be stronger.

the only benefit of going to the socon is geography and closer rivals, the caa imo will still be the stonger league.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2004 4:23 pm 
A couple of points. First of all, ETSU left the OVC for the SoCon in 1978, prompting the conference's first expansions (Akron, Youngstown State) beyond Kentucky and Tennessee (note that Evansville and Marshall were conference members in the early years). Frankly, I would be shocked and disappointed if the SoCon granted Georgia State the "Davidson exception" after giving ETSU and VMI the cold shoulder on the issue.

Also note that College of Charleston began its D-I tenure as a member of the Trans-America Athletic Conference (Atlantic Sun) before joining the Southern Conference in 1998.

For some reason when I think of SoCon expansion, I think of Samford, even despite the fact that it is a private school in the Central Time Zone...


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2004 9:51 am 
Well, believe it or not, Eatern Kentucky is the hot name running around now.

Hampton is out (not getting a look)
Coastal is out (basically not favored)
Gardner-Webb is out (ncaa sanctions)


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2004 10:42 am 
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are they interested or are they just what the socon wants?


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2004 9:12 am 
I'm not really sure to tell you the truth, I've been trying to dig up information, but not really getting too much.

The conference has made some visits, but nothing official yet. I think Coastal was one of those schools.

I am surprised that the conference has not even considered Hampton.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2004 11:51 am 
I think Coastal is the logical choice as an all sports member. They have good soccer, good baseball, and a great location. Football is really taking off. If you have any doubts look at their 2004 signees. I agree about UNC-W. They would be much better off in the Socon. Another great location. Also would improve the Socon's RPI. I don't think CofC leaves the conference simply because of travel costs.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2004 2:41 pm 
I don't think Coastal is going to get in. Believe it or not but Furman is 1 of the 5 schools against adding them (Davidson, Wofford, Citadel, CoC and Elon). Even App has mixed opinions on Coastal.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 12:54 pm 
Yes. I've heard that. I think the next member will have to be a large state school to placate App St. I read somewhere that the App AD mentioned Coastal by name as the most attractive candidate. I really don't know why Furman and the others opposes this.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 1:27 pm 
Because Furman, Elon, Wofford, Davidson don't want a school with less than standard academics to bring in less than academic players to win. Also, Coastal has the highest student dropout rate in DI.


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 Post subject: Who will join the Socon?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 18, 2004 1:47 pm 
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davidson should NOT be opposed to them. if they join, they will probably be place in the south division, which would allow davidson to move up north with the rest of the nc schools at utc.

if an ovc school joined, they would probably be in the north division as a rival/travel partner for utc. therefore davidson should be grateful for this opportunity and take advantage of it.


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