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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2005 11:33 pm 
The article Quinn posted about WKU exploring options with the MAC or MVC made me wonder if the following might happen....

MVC invites WKU and Western Illinois to join the MVC as all-sports members (both already play FB in the Gateway). Then the MVC would have 12 schools. The Gateway would still have 8 members, but 7 would be MVC member schools (along with FB only affiliate Youngstown State).

At this point, the Gateway becomes the MVC FB league.

This is sort of a variation on what wbyeager describes in post #35 above....


Denver might also be fishing to join the MVC (or anything more geographically desirable than the SunBelt, other than the Mid-Con). However Denver has no FB, and would not help with FB consolidation. WIU is solidly within the current MVC foot-print.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 3:25 pm 
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Quote:
The article Quinn posted about WKU exploring options with the MAC or MVC made me wonder if the following might happen....

MVC invites WKU and Western Illinois to join the MVC as all-sports members (both already play FB in the Gateway). Then the MVC would have 12 schools. The Gateway would still have 8 members, but 7 would be MVC member schools (along with FB only affiliate Youngstown State).

At this point, the Gateway becomes the MVC FB league.

This is sort of a variation on what wbyeager describes in post #35 above....


Denver might also be fishing to join the MVC (or anything more geographically desirable than the SunBelt, other than the Mid-Con). However Denver has no FB, and would not help with FB consolidation. WIU is solidly within the current MVC foot-print.


Western Illinois will not be in the MVC for all-sports. Other than footprint, they don't offer much. FB they don't care but for basketball and other sports.

Western Kentucky would have been in the MVC this year if SLU had done what was right for them instead of trying to be bigger than what they are.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 4:30 pm 
So WKU's choice of conference is predicated on Saint Louis U ?

SLU does look like a geographic out-layer in the A-10.

I can only think that they are betting on a Big East Split, and a future Catholic Conference... the 8 non-football BE schools + maybe Dayton, Xavier, SLU (from the A-10) and maybe Notre Dame.

I just wonder if the split is a done deal, otherwise SLU made a very bold move. Their nearest A-10 school in in SW Ohio !

SLU has been associated with the MVC schools in the past, I guess this Catholic Conference has more big-time appeal for them.... otherwise I don't understand their logic.

I live in St. Louis Suburbs and have never seen any other rational explanation.

WKU would be on the southern fringe of the MVC. SIU is in spitting distance. SEMO (Cape Girardeau) would be close if they ever up-graded to D-1.

I don't know if the MVC wants WKU. WKU lacks a major airport, but I'll bet a lot of conference commercial travel has to change planes in St. L anyway. WKU would seem to be a decent choice if the conference wanted to expand and consolidate the Gateway into all-sports MVC.

Who would be a #12 ?

Denver maybe ? Although they are well west of Omaha, and Wichita.

If the SunBelt is indeed scrambling to line up replacements (behind the scenes), maybe departure of WKU and Denver is imminent. Sun-Belt may want to transform itself into all-sports long term, and ease out the BB schools. The SoCon is a likely place to search for replacement schools that have D-1A aspirations.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 4:44 pm 
Where is this sudden impetus for the Gateway being redubbed "Missouri Valley" coming from? Why would the GFC need more MVC members in order for this to happen? Look at the composition of the "A-10" and the MAAC Football League...

The CAA was creating a football league with or without the participation of Richmond, Villanova, Maine, New Hampshire, Massachusetts or Rhode Island...the A-10 could have continued to maintain a 6-team football contingent but chose not to...the CAA dangled Northeastern membership to assure its participation in CAA Football, even though it could have still been a "football-only" member in the CAA anyway...


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 4:51 pm 
Also, Denver's I-AAA status would not be relevant in a discussion of MVC expansion...using the "A-10" as an example, there is no perceptible reason that the GFC couldn't be called "MVC" right now...the MVC dealt with football-oriented expansion in the 1970s and 1980s, with results that would prove counterproductive...see the "Big West-ification" of the PCAA and the "northwest passage" of the Sun Belt Conference...


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2005 7:14 pm 
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Quote:
So WKU's choice of conference is predicated on Saint Louis U ?

SLU does look like a geographic out-layer in the A-10.

I can only think that they are betting on a Big East Split, and a future Catholic Conference... the 8 non-football BE schools + maybe Dayton, Xavier, SLU (from the A-10) and maybe Notre Dame.

I just wonder if the split is a done deal, otherwise SLU made a very bold move. Their nearest A-10 school in in SW Ohio !

SLU has been associated with the MVC schools in the past, I guess this Catholic Conference has more big-time appeal for them.... otherwise I don't understand their logic.

I live in St. Louis Suburbs and have never seen any other rational explanation.

WKU would be on the southern fringe of the MVC. SIU is in spitting distance. SEMO (Cape Girardeau) would be close if they ever up-graded to D-1.

I don't know if the MVC wants WKU. WKU lacks a major airport, but I'll bet a lot of conference commercial travel has to change planes in St. L anyway. WKU would seem to be a decent choice if the conference wanted to expand and consolidate the Gateway into all-sports MVC.

Who would be a #12 ?

Denver maybe ? Although they are well west of Omaha, and Wichita.

If the SunBelt is indeed scrambling to line up replacements (behind the scenes), maybe departure of WKU and Denver is imminent. Sun-Belt may want to transform itself into all-sports long term, and ease out the BB schools. The SoCon is a likely place to search for replacement schools that have D-1A aspirations.


What I was getting at was that MVC probally wants WKU but they don't have #12, which SLU was their choice.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 1:16 pm 
gotcha.

Assuming the MVC even wants to expand.

Looking for schools in the greater MVC footprint:

Butler (Indianapolis) Horizon League, Pioneer FB
Oral Roberts (Tulsa) Mid-Con, no FB
U Missouri Kansas City Mid-Con, no FB
Western Illinois, (Macomb) Mid-Con, Gateway FB
Valparaiso (Indiana) Mid-Con, Pioneer FB
SEMo (Cape Girardeau) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Eastern Illinois (Charleston) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Eastern Kentucky (Richmond) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Murray State (Murray, Kentucky) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Western Kentucy (Bowling Green ?), SunBelt, Gateway FB
and finally the NDSU / SDSU (pair).

Assuming SLU considers themself too "big-time" to join the MVC, I would think any expansion candidates would come from the above list.

If the MVC is going to 12, I would think goals might be to consolidate the Gateway into the MVC (reel in some more I-AA FB teams) and minimize travel costs.
The former would suggest WKU, WIU, or an Ohio Valley School. Not sure which schools out of that sub-group would be most attractive.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 2:14 pm 
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butler would be a great addition to the MVC. Butler was on the A10 radar prior to Charlotte and St. Louis joining.

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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 3:02 pm 
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Quote:
gotcha.

Assuming the MVC even wants to expand.

Looking for schools in the greater MVC footprint:

Butler (Indianapolis) Horizon League, Pioneer FB
Oral Roberts (Tulsa) Mid-Con, no FB
U Missouri Kansas City Mid-Con, no FB
Western Illinois, (Macomb) Mid-Con, Gateway FB
Valparaiso (Indiana) Mid-Con, Pioneer FB
SEMo (Cape Girardeau) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Eastern Illinois (Charleston) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Eastern Kentucky (Richmond) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Murray State (Murray, Kentucky) Ohio Valley, plays FB
Western Kentucy (Bowling Green ?), SunBelt, Gateway FB
and finally the NDSU / SDSU (pair).

Assuming SLU considers themself too "big-time" to join the MVC, I would think any expansion candidates would come from the above list.

If the MVC is going to 12, I would think goals might be to consolidate the Gateway into the MVC (reel in some more I-AA FB teams) and minimize travel costs.
The former would suggest WKU, WIU, or an Ohio Valley School. Not sure which schools out of that sub-group would be most attractive.


Other than Western Kentucky none of those teams MVC wants. Go to valleytalk.net and they have a discussion on this. Even Western Kentucky most fans dont want.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2005 3:38 pm 
Well you could be 100% right.

Then again these decisions are made by the member college presidents (not fans on an internet chat room).
In fact, the college presidents often take their cues from a bunch of management consultants.

So we'll see....

Clearly the MVC doesn't have a real need to make any moves at this time. Unless they have their sights on WKU or somebody who is seriously contemplating a move in the very near term.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 4:36 am 
It looks like Western Kentucky wants to join the Missouri Valley Conference for basketball and its other sports besides football.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 11:42 am 
They probably wouldn need to add one more to get to 12.

Western Illinois?

Youngstown State?


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 11:59 am 
From a geography standpoint, Western Illinois works.

Youngstown State is a stretch. They would have a fair travel distance from NE Ohio just to their nearest neighbor in Indiana. Their aspirations MAY be to one day become 1-A FB and move to the MAC. (although the MAC is currently a tad over-loaded with Ohio Schools).

Does the MVC see any value in expanding ? Many of the Div I conferences are a tad reluctant to spread their haul from the BB tourney over more conference members (essentially diluting it). IF new members bring about the possibility of more revenue (via multiple bids) then they become more attractive as expansion candidates....


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 2:08 pm 
Butler and St. Louis aren't going to join the MVC. They had already been there and done that. See conference history for details.


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 Post subject: MVC Expansion
PostPosted: Sun Nov 06, 2005 2:38 pm 
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Quote:
Does the MVC see any value in expanding ? Many of the Div I conferences are a tad reluctant to spread their haul from the BB tourney over more conference members (essentially diluting it). IF new members bring about the possibility of more revenue (via multiple bids) then they become more attractive as expansion candidates....


MVC has move up in status among the basketball schools were they are probally the best of the non BCS conferences in hoops. They have their championship game on CBS now. I dont think they are going to add a Western Illinois or Youngstown State. I think if the MVC expands look for them or to try for a Xavier or Dayton or even SLU type.


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