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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 6:11 pm 
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freaked4collegefb wrote:
Article out of Richmond with comments from CAA Commish,VCU AD,George Mason AD and others denying yesterday's CBS report that VCU and George Mason are in membership discussions with A-10.Link at http://www2.timesdispatch.com/sports/co ... ar-1795081


"formally"

Backroom politics are awesome.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 7:27 pm 
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damn, JP your conference loses it's biggest name and looks even better and deeper than it did before. VCU, GMU, Butler. That would be 4 final four appearances by the 3 in the last 6 years. Now just wait for Charlotte to leave for the SBC and you could get ODU while they maybe put fb in the MAC.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:38 am 
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Another article out of Richmond with comments from CAA Commish and others regarding reports of VCU and George Mason "possibly" leaving for the A-10."So far",no denials coming from Butler or the Horizon league.Link at http://www2.timesdispatch.com/sports/20 ... ar-1796477


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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:46 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
damn, JP your conference loses it's biggest name and looks even better and deeper than it did before. VCU, GMU, Butler. That would be 4 final four appearances by the 3 in the last 6 years. Now just wait for Charlotte to leave for the SBC and you could get ODU while they maybe put fb in the MAC.


Yeah, but here's the thing:
VCU is having a good run with Shaka in charge. GMU had a good run in 2006 and is good in the CAA.

Those are two good teams.

Temple is a PROGRAM. They've been in 19 of the last 29 NCAA tournaments with six Elite Eight finishes. Butler can be considered in that "program" stage. They've done it a little more quietly, until their two Final Fours. But Temple's got a longer tradition of excellence than Butler. It'd definitely a step down.

All three would make the league a lot deeper. But honestly, that's what the A-10's problem has been: They could be a 5-6 bid league if there was a massive drop off between #6 and #7. The depth is kind of hurting them come Selection Sunday.

For example, look at this year.
Temple and Xavier got ranked. Saint Louis was an NCAA lock all year

Then you have:
Bonaventure went 10-6 in conference and finished fourth.... but lost to Illinois, Va Tech, NC State, Cleveland State, and Arkansas State (!). 7-5 out of conference? NO CHANCE at an at-large. If they don't choke a lead away vs Illinois and Va Tech. and give up a near buzzer beater to Cleveland State and a full on buzzer beater to NC State, they're 24-7 and safely in.

Dayton beat Temple, SLU, Alabama, Xavier, Ole Miss, UMass and Minnesota.... but in addition to eight acceptable losses, also lost to Miami OH, Rhode Island, Richmond, and Duquesne. If Dayton had Bona's conference season, they have gotten an at-large.

Saint Joe's beat Creighton, Temple and Drexel. But 9-7 in the A-10 with losses to #167 Charlotte, #126 Richmond.

UMass beat Temple, SLU, Xavier, Davidson, SJU, Bonaventure… but 9-7 with losses to URI, DUQ, #86 LaSalle (twice).

The league had eight Top 100 RPI teams, and 10 in the top 126. But a four-way tie for fifth at 9-7 and all four went to the NIT. Teams #9 and #10 beat the 9-7 teams a total of five times.

Look at Dayton's resume again. If they didn't lose to #9 and #10 in the A-10, they'd have been 22-10, #53 in the RPI and the A-10's FIFTH team.

The A-10 had 10 good teams. If they had eight good teams, the top six could have gotten NCAA bids.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:08 pm 
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I know but VCU did well w/ Caple and Grant too. You gotta start somewhere. Butler and GMU have the same coaches.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:55 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
I know but VCU did well w/ Caple and Grant too. You gotta start somewhere. Butler and GMU have the same coaches.


Butler's been good through three coaches now: Matta, Lickliter, now Stevens.

People forget that Florida's run to the finals in 2000 was almost derailed by Butler in the first round.
1997 (First)
1998 (First)
2000 (First, L to Florida 69-68 in OT)
2001 (2nd round, beat 7 seed Wake)
2003 (Sweet 16)
2007 (5 seed, Sweet 16)
2008 (7 seed, 2nd round, L to 2-seed Tennessee in OT)
2009 (9 seed)
2010 (5 seed, Final Four)
2011 (8 seed, Final Four)

10 NCAA bids in 15 years, with a 16-10 record in the Tournament.

Performance wise, Butler has been great when they get in. The question for them is: In a deep A-10, are they gonna be in the dance every year now, or are they going to be like Dayton, UMass, etc. 10-6 or 9-7 and in the NIT.


Also, Mason's Final Four coach went to Miami last offseason.

Don't get me wrong, these are the three best programs available. And the A-10 getting three would cement them as the #6 league in the country. The A-10 is better off with them because it weakens the Horizon and CAA. There's basically going to be 2-5 more bids to the tournament out there:

CUSA (Champ and maybe an at-large)
MWC (Champ and 2 sometimes 3 at-large)
CAA (Champ and sometimes an at-large)
Horizon (Champ and sometimes an at-large)
BWC (Champ)
That's five autos and 2-6 at-large bids.

Now you've got CUSA/MWC (champ, 1-3 at large)
SDSU winning the Big West (champ, no change)
CAA (Champ)
Horizon (Champ)
Four autos, 1-3 at larges

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:40 am 
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Article out of Omaha with comments from Creighton President who says that he has had only "informal"talks with A-10 colleagues about his school joining that league.Link at http://www.omaha.com/article/20120327/B ... 79856/1001


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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:44 am 
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could creighton and another midwestern horizon school be the backup plan if gmu and vcu decline? i would think loyola ill. would be next in line due to their market


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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:01 pm 
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accseahawk wrote:
could creighton and another midwestern horizon school be the backup plan if gmu and vcu decline? i would think loyola ill. would be next in line due to their market


Not a chance. The A10 expansion wishes, Butler along with VCU and GMU, expansion to 16, exists only because of what those programs bring to the A10. Butler is the clear get here...it keeps the 3 midwestern schools happy, adds the Indy market (where Butler actually does have some heat), and the 2 Finals appearances. VCU and GMU make the DC/VA market the A10 hotspot, home of the new A10 HQ, with GW/Richmond/VCU/GMU. It's not a matter of the A10 replacing Temple with 3 schools just to get to 16, it's the A10 thinking about replacing Temple with 3 NCAA tourney schools that made it to the Final Four, while improving the market presence in markets that matter.

Now, we've heard Creighton mentioned too. So there could be a backup plan in place where they are in the loop in some way. My guess, and only a guess, is that Butler is in the A10 no matter what. If Charlotte leaves for the Sunbelt or CUSA/MWC, and they want a single replacement, Creighton could be in the mix...but only if Charlotte (or UMass I guess as a longshot) leave. VCU and GMU are in the mix, high in the mix, because of what they offer...not just because they are warm bodies.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:04 pm 
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fair enough. This Creighton talk just seems to be coming out of nowhere. I figured though if Charlotte were to leave, A10 would make a push for ODU and have them follow the UMass model for FBS football. ODU, VCU, Richmond, and GMU would be a nice VA flank for the A10.


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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:36 pm 
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accseahawk wrote:
fair enough. This Creighton talk just seems to be coming out of nowhere. I figured though if Charlotte were to leave, A10 would make a push for ODU and have them follow the UMass model for FBS football. ODU, VCU, Richmond, and GMU would be a nice VA flank for the A10.

Only issue is that it's not the A10's call, it's the MAC's. UMass is in the A10 and the MAC for football, because the MAC provided a home for FBS football. For ODU to be in a similar position, they too would need the MAC to answer their calls. Could happen, but if you're the MAC looking at ANOTHER FCS upgrade, wouldn't you push on UD and JMU first, and only ODU if both passed on the one spot?

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 5:18 pm 
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Quinn wrote:
accseahawk wrote:
fair enough. This Creighton talk just seems to be coming out of nowhere. I figured though if Charlotte were to leave, A10 would make a push for ODU and have them follow the UMass model for FBS football. ODU, VCU, Richmond, and GMU would be a nice VA flank for the A10.

Only issue is that it's not the A10's call, it's the MAC's. UMass is in the A10 and the MAC for football, because the MAC provided a home for FBS football. For ODU to be in a similar position, they too would need the MAC to answer their calls. Could happen, but if you're the MAC looking at ANOTHER FCS upgrade, wouldn't you push on UD and JMU first, and only ODU if both passed on the one spot?

If UDel or JMU wanted to come then absolutely, I'm sure someone is keeping the line of communication open with them Youngstown St and Richmond too...

But I think the MAC wants to balance out the divisions so I think whoever wants to jump first will get the spot...13 in fb is just ugly.

No reason why they couldn't go to 16 in a couple of years with the other teams we mentioned especially if they just add them as football onlys.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 5:20 pm 
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Quinn wrote:
accseahawk wrote:
fair enough. This Creighton talk just seems to be coming out of nowhere. I figured though if Charlotte were to leave, A10 would make a push for ODU and have them follow the UMass model for FBS football. ODU, VCU, Richmond, and GMU would be a nice VA flank for the A10.

Only issue is that it's not the A10's call, it's the MAC's. UMass is in the A10 and the MAC for football, because the MAC provided a home for FBS football. For ODU to be in a similar position, they too would need the MAC to answer their calls. Could happen, but if you're the MAC looking at ANOTHER FCS upgrade, wouldn't you push on UD and JMU first, and only ODU if both passed on the one spot?


UD is private and "small" and has non-scholarship football. For them to make the move to FCS would mean adding 126 new scholarships. Plus a new stadium (they play in a very old, very run down "stadium" (stands on each side, track around it) that is owned by Dayton Public Schools.

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 5:57 pm 
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JPSchmack wrote:
Quinn wrote:
accseahawk wrote:
fair enough. This Creighton talk just seems to be coming out of nowhere. I figured though if Charlotte were to leave, A10 would make a push for ODU and have them follow the UMass model for FBS football. ODU, VCU, Richmond, and GMU would be a nice VA flank for the A10.

Only issue is that it's not the A10's call, it's the MAC's. UMass is in the A10 and the MAC for football, because the MAC provided a home for FBS football. For ODU to be in a similar position, they too would need the MAC to answer their calls. Could happen, but if you're the MAC looking at ANOTHER FCS upgrade, wouldn't you push on UD and JMU first, and only ODU if both passed on the one spot?


UD is private and "small" and has non-scholarship football. For them to make the move to FCS would mean adding 126 new scholarships. Plus a new stadium (they play in a very old, very run down "stadium" (stands on each side, track around it) that is owned by Dayton Public Schools.

He's saying UD=Delaware

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 Post subject: Re: A10 Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:19 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
He's saying UD=Delaware


Understandable mistake, since we're in the A-10 thread and Dayton's an A-10 team.

Also, until the Blue Hens make a men's basketball Final Four, UD means Dayton. :D

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