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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 3:32 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
The Bishin Cutter wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
The northern schools are probably still demanding that the expansion include at least 1-2 new northern teams.


If that's to be believed, then Stony Brook and Albany must be oh so happy in the AE and not actually want full CAA membership. Do you believe they only want to be football members?


The one to two northern teams I'm referring to are Albany and Stony Brook--I think both of these schools would be interested in full membership rather than their football-only status but I don't think there are enough votes in the CAA right now for them to get invited. It's not that they've rebuffed the CAA, their invitations have yet to materialize.


this!

I highly doubt any northern schools will be added for all sports until the southern flank is taken care of. The votes are not there


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 8:10 pm 
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tute79 wrote:
There has to be something going on here behind the scenes.

Yeah, no official meetings during the march madness (now over), but there are so many schools here with their athletics future hanging in the balance,
that there must be a lot of phone calls and diiscussion (maybe not so much at the conference level).

It seems obvious to several of us that the AE, CAA and SoCon have enough teams for 2 conferences.

If the conf. commissioners go all Macchiavelian and put the survival of THEIR conference above everything else, it will create a mess,
with conferences perhaps trying to poach each other at the same time.
Ultimately, the conference commissioners work at the behest of the member schools, and if the member schools work out something decent behind the scenes,
and then the college presidents and ADs ask the commissioners to implement it, that might be for the best.

It almost appears that there is a "news black-out" about who is chasing who here....
When Freaked isn't turning up blogs and articles and leaks on three (3) different conferences (all of which appear to be "in play" right now), it makes me suspicious.


There most certainly backroom dealing going on. The first question to be answered is whether the SoCon will take the CAA's southern wing or if Davidson and 2 friends would rather be CAA members. While it would make sense for the 3 conferences to work together the CAA sees itself as the superior conference and its members probably have that attitude at the negotiating table--preferring to be the conference that takes on new members rather than being the conference ripped apart. The CAA could score a major victory if they were to add 5 schools: Davidson, Elon, UNC Greensboro, Albany, and Stony Brook.

While it would mean splitting things 14 ways, the 7-member North and South Divisions minimize travel when you factor in double round-robin within your division (12 games) and playing 6 of the 7 members in the opposite division 1 game each.

Sure it would be a huge stab in the back to New Hampshire, Maine, and fellow SUNY school Binghampton but realignment is a nasty, cruel game sometimes. AmEast can rebuild with NJIT and another DII upgrade or two--or if the NEC would lighten up its stance regarding fb, C Conn St would be a good fit. As for the SoCon, they too can and will bounce back between adding the best of the Big South and some of these fledgling A-Sun programs


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 7:49 am 
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accseahawk wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
The Bishin Cutter wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
The northern schools are probably still demanding that the expansion include at least 1-2 new northern teams.


If that's to be believed, then Stony Brook and Albany must be oh so happy in the AE and not actually want full CAA membership. Do you believe they only want to be football members?


The one to two northern teams I'm referring to are Albany and Stony Brook--I think both of these schools would be interested in full membership rather than their football-only status but I don't think there are enough votes in the CAA right now for them to get invited. It's not that they've rebuffed the CAA, their invitations have yet to materialize.


this!

I highly doubt any northern schools will be added for all sports until the southern flank is taken care of. The votes are not there



But that's what I don't quite understand. If the northern schools (I assume this means Drexel, Hofstra, and Northeastern) are the ones who want more northern members, then how are SB and Albany not already full members? They are public institutions, so I find it very difficult that the other public schools, other than the geographic outliers UNCW and CoC, would block them. This perceived "let's fill in the south" makes no sense. There is no "south" anymore in the CAA. Other than "the gaps" (UNCW/COC) and a JMU that's about ready to leave, this conference became an I-95 corridor type. The basketball arm closely resembles the football one, spare the lonely southern "outposts."

If there's an "urgency" to filling in the south, it's done with the support of northern private members who don't want additional public school nothern members. Vermont's been out there for ages...


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 12:43 pm 
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The Bishin Cutter wrote:
accseahawk wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
The Bishin Cutter wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
The northern schools are probably still demanding that the expansion include at least 1-2 new northern teams.


If that's to be believed, then Stony Brook and Albany must be oh so happy in the AE and not actually want full CAA membership. Do you believe they only want to be football members?


The one to two northern teams I'm referring to are Albany and Stony Brook--I think both of these schools would be interested in full membership rather than their football-only status but I don't think there are enough votes in the CAA right now for them to get invited. It's not that they've rebuffed the CAA, their invitations have yet to materialize.


this!

I highly doubt any northern schools will be added for all sports until the southern flank is taken care of. The votes are not there



But that's what I don't quite understand. If the northern schools (I assume this means Drexel, Hofstra, and Northeastern) are the ones who want more northern members, then how are SB and Albany not already full members? They are public institutions, so I find it very difficult that the other public schools, other than the geographic outliers UNCW and CoC, would block them. This perceived "let's fill in the south" makes no sense. There is no "south" anymore in the CAA. Other than "the gaps" (UNCW/COC) and a JMU that's about ready to leave, this conference became an I-95 corridor type. The basketball arm closely resembles the football one, spare the lonely southern "outposts."

If there's an "urgency" to filling in the south, it's done with the support of northern private members who don't want additional public school nothern members. Vermont's been out there for ages...


That's a hard question to answer. Of the 8 members who still have voting privileges in the CAA I am guessing that UNC Wilmington, W&M, and one other (James Madison?) are blocking the affirmation of SB and Albany. Before Mason left, they too were probably a no vote. Delaware and Towson might also be weary of voting yes for those 2 w/o any southern expansion out of fear that the northern additions would cause southern members to leave (W&M, JMU, & Richmond fb would be of concern to them).


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:55 am 
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With the news that Davidson's supposedly A10-bound, totally leapfrogging the CAA altogether, and the supposed loyalty pledges by some of these SoCon schools to stay with the conference, where's the CAA to turn?


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 11:12 am 
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I have not heard anything about a loyalty pledge, so here is my analysis.

Davidson to the A10 makes sense for Davidson. Like the A10, Davidson emphasizes nothing but Men's Basketball. Geographically they would be outlier, but with the a strong VA/DC presence, it won't be too bad for Davidson.

What this means for UNCW? Well it certainly would have been nice to grab Davidson, but the CAA still needs to be focused on adding a strong southern division. If Davidson is off the board, the schools I would focus on are UNCG and Elon. I don't see any reason there would be a SoCon CAA merger. The SoCon has plenty of options the departure of 3 Public schools allow them to reestablish themselves as a small southern private school focused league with an emphasis on FCS football. They will be fine.

So if Davidson is truly off the board, time to move to plan B and add Elon, UNCG, and Stony Brook.

North: Northeastern, Hofstra, Stony Brook, Delaware, Drexel, Towson
South: JMU, W&M, Elon, UNCG, UNCW, CoC.

FCS CAA: Maine, UNH, URI, Albany, Stony Brook, Villanova, Delaware, Towson, JMU, W&M, Richmond, Elon

To answer your question about southern additions, if you don't establish a southern flank you lose W&M to the Patriot, JMU to the Sunbelt, Richmond to the Patriot, CoC looks for an escape hatch, and you have a pissed off UNCW making life miserable for you and your conference at every turn.

JMU does not seem to want to join the Sunbelt so best to keep them happy with southern additions. This keeps W&M and Richmond happy which makes southern expansion a likelihood which makes UNCW and CoC extremely happy.


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 2:00 pm 
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accseahawk wrote:
I have not heard anything about a loyalty pledge...


I was talking about Furman and Wofford. UTC said something along the same lines.


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 4:42 pm 
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With Davidson going to the A-10 the CAA's master expansion plan is completely shot to pieces. If I am College of Charleston I'd consider giving my CAA invitation back.


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 4:45 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
With Davidson going to the A-10 the CAA's master expansion plan is completely shot to pieces. If I am College of Charleston I'd consider giving my CAA invitation back.

Why? 4 schools just left the SoCon. I wouldn't count the CAA out of adding UNCG. As of now CAA has a tv contract SoCon doesn't

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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 5:32 pm 
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Fresno St. Alum wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
With Davidson going to the A-10 the CAA's master expansion plan is completely shot to pieces. If I am College of Charleston I'd consider giving my CAA invitation back.

Why? 4 schools just left the SoCon. I wouldn't count the CAA out of adding UNCG. As of now CAA has a tv contract SoCon doesn't


True, Elon is still in play too if they want to more than 10 but Davidson was the real prize they were after in this southern expansion and that option has sailed away.


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 6:20 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
Fresno St. Alum wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
With Davidson going to the A-10 the CAA's master expansion plan is completely shot to pieces. If I am College of Charleston I'd consider giving my CAA invitation back.

Why? 4 schools just left the SoCon. I wouldn't count the CAA out of adding UNCG. As of now CAA has a tv contract SoCon doesn't


True, Elon is still in play too if they want to more than 10 but Davidson was the real prize they were after in this southern expansion and that option has sailed away.

Oh yeah, Elon, even higher on the list than UNCG

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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:12 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
Fresno St. Alum wrote:
fighting muskie wrote:
With Davidson going to the A-10 the CAA's master expansion plan is completely shot to pieces. If I am College of Charleston I'd consider giving my CAA invitation back.

Why? 4 schools just left the SoCon. I wouldn't count the CAA out of adding UNCG. As of now CAA has a tv contract SoCon doesn't


True, Elon is still in play too if they want to more than 10 but Davidson was the real prize they were after in this southern expansion and that option has sailed away.


Yes the CAA wanted Davidson, but there are other options that allow the conference to be successful. CAA needs 3 new members. Elon is definitely #1 in the Southern additions now. Davidson choosing the A10 was a bummer, but it was also expected and it still destabilized the SoCon enough making it easier to grab Elon.

Now southern #2 is interesting. UNCG is the somewhat obvious choice, but rumblings on caazone say that Mercer may be appearing on the CAA radar. A private school (a plus for the NE non football trio of NE, Hofstra, Drexel) that could be paired with CoC for travel and has a solid basketball program. They are also adding football, albeit non scholarship, which could help CAA football, long term, if needed.

Nothern #1 is either Albany or Stony Brook. Stony Brook appears to me as the obvious choice, but there are also rumblings that Hofstra is blocking Stony Brook. As a fan of a school who has been dying for a regional rival this sounds like the dumbest thing ever but northeastern basketball schools have a history of poor decisions so the CAA may choose Albany to keep the peace.

New CAA
Northeastern
Hofstra
Albany/Stony Brook
Delaware
Drexel
Towson

JMU
W&M
Elon
UNCW
CoC
Mercer/UNCG

The days of consistent multibids and comparisons to the A10 are likely gone for the foreseeable future, but the foundation for a successful conference full of schools committed to all around athletics can be achieved


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2013 12:03 pm 
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Not sure at this point, if CAA or SoCOn is more attractive. I think personally the only thing the CAA has going for it is the CAA Football conference.
Otherwise the CAA is a spread-out mess, and JMU and Delaware may pack up and leave soon for FBS (like the MAC). [Or maybe not...., just what I read].

UNCG is the only non-FB school remaining in the SoCon.
If VMI / Mercer / ETSU are invited, I'm betting they will be expected to play SoCon FB at the FCS level (none of that Pioneer League stuff).
So if UNCG wanted to leave for the CAA, the SoCon might not try to dissuade them.


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2013 4:06 pm 
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The CAA doesn't necessarily need 3 schools--with Davidson off the board the CAA needs to adjust to being a one-bid league and as a one-bid league its better to have 10 members, splitting the money between fewer schools. They could go with the travel pairs:

Northeastern/Hofstra
Drexel/Delaware
Towson/James Madison
Wm & Mary/UNCG
UNCW/CoC


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 Post subject: Re: CAA Realignment
PostPosted: Wed May 08, 2013 4:25 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
The CAA doesn't necessarily need 3 schools--with Davidson off the board the CAA needs to adjust to being a one-bid league and as a one-bid league its better to have 10 members, splitting the money between fewer schools. They could go with the travel pairs:

Northeastern/Hofstra
Drexel/Delaware
Towson/James Madison
Wm & Mary/UNCG
UNCW/CoC

I'd get to 12 now if I could b/c James Madison could end up in the SBC next year and Delaware in the MAC. If those 2 leave then count on William & Mary going to the Patriot. N/S at 12 would save on travel too.

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