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PostPosted: Sun Dec 19, 2004 11:02 pm 
Three of their four losses were to Oklahoma, Texas, and Utah...


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 19, 2004 11:36 pm 
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Three of their four losses were to Oklahoma, Texas, and Utah...


That would seem to be pretty convincing evidence that they can't beat a Top Ten team. What's the catch here?

Obviously, you've looked at their record, so you know that they also lost to a terrible Baylor team & struggled to get by a so-so Colorado team. I'm stillnot convinced that a 13 point win over a 7-4 A&M team should have vaulted Texas over Cal when Cal didn't lose. And, of course, it didn't put them ahead until the USM game. However, you apparently feel that win showed that Texas was better. That's fine with me.

Again, I'm not making a case for Cal. OBviously, the Cal-Texas thing was a close call. A case can be made for either team. The point of this thread is that it should be decided onthe field & not by an opinion poll - especially one that can be influenced by politicking & corruption.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 12:54 am 
The polls are inherently based on politicking and "corruption"...also, why do you insist on reiterating that you AREN'T a Cal apologist...


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:03 am 
What team lost to Cal but defeated a top ten opponent?

How many BCS-ranked teams did Cal beat? How many did Texas beat? Why did Oklahoma beat Oregon by 24 but Cal only beat them by 1?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 1:07 am 
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The polls are inherently based on politicking and "corruption"...also, why do you insist on reiterating that you AREN'T a Cal apologist...


"Politicking & corruption" . . . Exactly - & that's why the system should be changed.

I keep reiterating that I'm not a Cal apologist because this thread was started to explore questions about politics & corruption, specifically as alleged about Mack Brown. However, repeatedly there have been posts explaining why Texas deserved to be chosen over Cal. I've simply been trying to bring the thread back to the point with which it was started. I've been trying to say that whether Cal or Texas is more deserving is not the point; the point is whether that question can be fairly resolved under the present system. I find myself explaining the Cal side of the argument just to show that there are 2 sides to the argument & felt I needed to say, however, that this was not my main issue.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 8:20 am 
Everyone has been bombarded with the Cal arguments in the media for the better part of the last two weeks...


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:48 pm 
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FF,
As I pointed out in another post, Cal is whining because they were rated 7th or 8th in 6 coaches polls. This is stated over and over in the media.

Texas was rated 7th or 8th in 8 coaches polls. You never hear that.

Part of the reason Texas gained on Cal, was that a lot of the teams behind Texas lost, meaning Texas gained a lot of votes, and since Texas was behind Cal, benefitted more than Cal from those losses.

Ouija is right about the "what have you done for me lately" syndrome in polls. And besides the fact that Texas A&M is a vastly superior team, ranked in the top 25, and an arch-rival, Texas was in control the whole game. Cal was about to be tied with 6 minutes left when they blocked an extra point. They then added an insurance TD a few minutes later.

And the reason Cal was rated ahead of Texas all season and still at the end was ONE game. Cal gave USC all they could handle and the pollsters never forgot that. And I fail to see the logic that makes 23-17 much different from a 12-0 game that was 6-0 mid-way through the 4th quarter.

Polls have lots of flaws. I think manipulation is probably one of the smaller flaws. A better case for manipulation was the gains Auburn made on OU after the pleading by the Auburn coach.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 20, 2004 11:49 pm 
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The best answer is, USC won the Pac 10.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:09 am 
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If anyone wants a Cal apologist, I'll gladly volunteer.

Texas wasn't going to stop Cal's balanced offense. End of story.

Still, and I've said this before, Mack Brown isn't the first guy to engage in this self-pity hype game. The BCS practically demands this sort of behavior take place. Jeff Tedford failed to counter, and Tom Hanson may have spent his "capital" on getting Oregon State to the Fiesta in 2000. Bottom line is that the BCS really does devalue performance, no?


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2004 2:01 pm 
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While I would have preferred Michigan playing Cal, at least here is an interesting perspective on parallels in the Michigan and Texas programs. Should be an enjoyable game, and hey, it will be much more fun to see the Texas band with their distinctive uniforms and hats in the Rose Bowl parade than the Cal band...

http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/aanews/football/index.ssf?/base/sports-1/1104059407248562.xml

8-)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2004 4:14 pm 
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Everyone has been bombarded with the Cal arguments in the media for the better part of the last two weeks...


This is because Cal got screwed...Texas does NOT belong in the Rose Bowl, Cal does, and most people outside of the state of Texas who understand college football realize this.
8-)


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2004 6:27 pm 

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Mr Ouija
Cal didn't win the Pac-10...
« Reply #28 on 12/27/2004 at 4:12pm »
[Quote] [Modify] [Delete]




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PostPosted: Mon Dec 27, 2004 10:26 pm 
Cal drops in votes after winning appropriately a postponed road game at Southern Miss? Texas did not play------and remember they were shut out by Oklahoma 12-0. Incidentally, Southern Miss was a bowl team and won.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2004 2:18 pm 
That encapsulates the whole situation...Texas was able to lie in wait while Cal needed a game-changing blocked extra point in the 4th quarter to defeat a pedestrian Southern Mississippi team...other than the season-opener at Air Force, I can't remember Cal ever actually being nationally-televised...

Why are all of the pre-December 5th poll votes presumed to be so sacrosanct so as to make the December 5th poll votes "questionable"...


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 28, 2004 8:42 pm 
[quote author=Guest-Mr Ouija .

Why are all of the pre-December 5th poll votes presumed to be so sacrosanct so as to make the December 5th poll votes "questionable"... [/quote]

Because after Cal destroyed Stanford and Texas had a bye week, Texas picked up 22 points in the AP poll compared to Texas' 4. In the Coaches poll Texas picked up 48 points while Cal actually lost 12. This after Cal won 41-6 and Texas was sitting at home. It was obvious from that moment on that the fix was in. You can get all pious about how Texas deserved it over Cal and maybe they did, but there's no question that Texas got in by politics, not by skill on the field.


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