Under PC jargon, yes, Ole Miss Rebels is patently offensive (at least they don't fly the Confederate flag at games anymore). Now that I think about it, the "Orangemen" were victorious (Battle of the Boyne, 1690) and have remained so, while the "Roundheads" did not retain power for a significant period after the death of Cromwell (Cavaliers restored). Are any other team nicknames actively used by a paramilitary group out of a basis that is arguably similar (both are derived from the House of Orange)? PC jargon still condemns Ole Miss Rebels because of the implications it connotes out of deference to a "protected" group; as Catholics do not meet said PC criteria, they are not entitled to the same "protections." Both the Syracuse Orangemen and the Ulster "Orangemen" have derived their nicknames in deference to the House of Orange, whose leader Willem drove the Spanish out of the Netherlands but also guaranteed that portions of Ireland ("northern six") would affectively remain a "British colony." The winners make the rules and the PC intelligensia create their own and exert pressure on the spineless.

Hmm,

On behalf of animal rights activists everywhere, and on the grounds of sacred PC correctness, I protest on behalf of all unfairly caricaturized, stigmatized, and innacurately depicted badgers, gophers, wolverines, cougars, yellow jackets, tigers, terrapins, wildcats, horned toads, longhorns, razorbacks, rams, and buffalos everywhere...

And on behalf of all sooners, jayhawks, cornhuskers, and buckeyes, I would demand equal time and consideration for laters, jilldoves, wheatthreshers, and chestnut fans everywhere.

And on behalf of Greeks, I demand equal time from the Trojans, and on behalf of the same, equal time for the Athenians from the warlike Spartans...

And because of those darn nasty Crimson Tides, I demand equal time for Crystal Clear Ebbs.

And for all the forgotten and noble Indian tribes that have not yet been represented by the likes of Utes, Illini, Chippewas, Seminoles, etc. I demand equal representation among the councils of the noble Indian mascots....

And last, but not least, I demand that Hoyas and Hokies be allowed to switch school mascots every five years between themselves, just to equallize any unfavorable connotation the name might engender to any offended person, wherever or whomever he, she, or it might be...

;D :D ;D :D ;D

Can Marquette "Warriors" and Saint John's "Redmen" nicknames justifiably be reinstated and Chicago State "Colonels" (apparently "racist") be justifiably restored? Yes or No?

Won't tackle that, but here is coming at it from a less satirical point of view:

The team whose name I always kind of admired, since it shows they have the intelligence and self-esteem to poke fun at their own stereotype and heritage, don't take offense easily, and don't care a hoot about PC, is the following:

The Vancouver CANUCKS.

Would everyone had the same maturity as our good Canadian friends...eh?....

:)

I thought that for both Marquette and St. John's the move to change the school nickname was of school initiative, done without pressure but in an attempt to ensure their fans and others alike that the school was of noble intention? My discussions with members of the Creek and Cherokee nation have not felt too disturbed about the terms "Warriors" or "Braves," but were less enthusiastic about Redskins or Redmen, even if the allusions were sincere or respectful.

I noted that TMQ on ESPN.com says the courts wll rule this year regarding the legality of a trademark for the "Redskins" name and logo. I suspect there'll be a new team in Washington come 2005.

Of course Marquette and Saint John's took "initiative" in the literal sense, because such a change cannot be legally mandated, not even (at least so far) for public instituions. The Redskins' issue has to do with copyright protection. The Redskins' can use their current nickname for as long as they want to short of NFL intervention. However, if the trademark protection is discontinued, they would lose their registered trademark and all protections entailed therein (i.e. licensing fees).

Marquette and Saint John's caved into the demands of PC elites, which is most ironic because, as Catholic institutions, because, their status as Christian, Catholic institutions already implies an "adversarial" status in the eyes of dogmatic adherents of "political correctness," and thus they complied to demands elicited by those already on record as being adamantly opposed to any sort of public recognition of their beliefs.

Vancouver Canucks is "derisive" in the same sense that New York Yankees is "derisive."

Pub', get the bug out of your ass. Unwad your panties. I'll stick to LSU football if you would say anything at all that has anything to do with sports in this thread.

So it's settled--"Orangemen" will forever be the nickname of Syracuse.

Shut up you in inbred, slackjawed douche bag. I like how it took you almost an entire day to come up with a response...and even then you just generalized by somehow making the equivocation that I was a woman or that I had a bug in I disagree. Don't you have a lynching or a David Duke rally to go to?

Hey Pub, that was a lot of class on your part. ::) >:(
LSUtootnany, you can't say that you didn't provoke Pub a tad for him to make that statement either. Let's play nice. 8-)

Great post Javaman!!! BTW, are you going to protest on the behalf of unfairly caricaturized, stigmatized, and inaccurately depicted bulldogs everywhere as well. ;)

For the record, even as someone of Irish Catholic descent, I personally don't have a problem with the nickname "Orangemen," I was just trying to prove a point on the folly of taking the PC issue of "offensive nicknames" to any and all logical extremes, and speculate as to why it appears relevant in some aspects (Florida State Seminoles, etal) and not others (e.g. Syracuse Orangemen, Holy Cross Crusaders, etc., etc., ad nauseam).

I personally do not have a problem with any currently used nicknames with the exception of "Indians," a term which was never even factually correct in the first place (even when one contends that the Native Americans emigrated to North America from Asia and this justifies the assertion, it must be restated that they did not literally come to North America from "India," which is where Columbus first assumed he had landed) and "Redskins" (I don't think that one necessarily requires explanation, but I also feel that the Washington Redskins should retain their copyright protection as a matter of law).

Let's face it. The issue of this board is "conference realignment," and that issue, while sport-oriented, has more to do with politics than anything else--sports is just the backdrop of the medium being used. The exertion of pressure under PC tenets is a further manifestation of the blurring lines between politics and sport.

Personally I feel that changing "offensive" nicknames is not good business for universities because it only furthers the disconnect between "old money" (and other alumni) from their collegiate experience, which in turn, could produce diminishing returns from athletic department coffers. If you don't believe me, look at how UGA fans reacted when Vince Dooley's tenure as AD came to an end (I don't believe he was fired, however, he was not retained?) to the consternation of many prominent alumni.

You just said a lot worse than the name "Orangemen" could even imply. I didn't assume you were a woman--just that you wore panties. I'm also going to assume that you're really short--you reek of short-man syndrome. Now say something about sports--these hypersensitive political conversations suck.

It sounds like Bobby Boucher is ignorant of history and has serious gender issues...they are even reflective in the name he uses to post. I think he should start using the name TulanePootieTang (TPT).

Keep the argument going LSUtootnanny and Publius. ;D ;D ;D

Roy Moore is shameless opportunist wasting taxpayer money in order to receive eternal demagogue status amongst Alabamians for years to come. He has used a taxpayer-funded court building as his own personal soapbox and is now acting as though he is the second coming of George Wallace and invoking the same warmed-over "states' rights" arguments that have been invoked for years in efforts to deflect attentions from central ideological beliefs.

Almost forgot...why did 'Bama hire Mike Shula and not Tom Coughlin?