Your right TS2. The BE is not going to split. They don't have to. The good teams just keep leaving. (Miami, VT, and BC). The great teams aren't allowed to join. (Penn ST.) Any the teams that are thrown out (Temple) are finding greener pastures in our good ole affiliate the MAC, that you and Trained Geese have the BE kissing on the a$$.
This is one of the silliest posts I have read in a long time.
1. Penn State was never refused membership in Big East Football, which would have welcomed their application. It has been reported that they were turned down by the Big East when it was a basketball-only conference. Penn State has never been anything but a mediocre basketball program at best, so why would a basketball conference have been interested in them? Furthermore, Joe Pa has denied this report & has said that they never applied for Big East membership. He has said that they initiated talks with Big East football members (only BC & Syracuse at the time) about joining with Penn State to form an Eastern all-sports conference. Since Big East basketball was the hottest ticket in town at the time, BC & Syracuse were understandably not interested in sacrificing that. Penn State, on the other hand, had nothing to lose. From the football perspective, many of college football's best programs were independent at the time, so there was no incentive for BC & Syracuse to join a conference to upgrade football.
2. The good teams just keep leaving? Please tell me what programs will continue this exodus of good programs leaving. And for what destination will they leave? The AC pulled off a one time coup. The Big Ten doesn't seem interested in a championship game, so 11 works for them. Are Eastern schools leaving for the PAC Ten? Or are 12 member conferences expanding?
3. And silliest of all is the idea that Temple found greener pastures in the MAC! :o ;D ::)
Friar fan, thanks for the comments. I am pleased you opened and elaborated on the discussion.
Carolina Knights can defend his own posts. As you responded to another one of his posts, he tends to write well and comes across as very thoughtful. Again, while he can speak for himself, I interpret his reply as a toungeNcheek response, on the undisguised sarcastic side, toward TS2, who can be quite opinionated, and sometimes inflaming, in support of the status quo in the East along with presenting "alliance developments" many struggle to believe or accept. No doubt, you are quite familiar with TS2's methodology.
I do not discredit TS2 specifically on what may be interpreted as his support of the status quo. He can speak for himself, which he indeed shall, as can Carolina Knight, a Rutgers alum, I understand, and a BE fan who comes across as open to BE expansion.
Certainly, there is a line of thinking within ranks of the BE (namely the BB schools/Notre Dame) that favor the status quo somewhat. That is not to say that "some" of the BE interests may not share similar thoughts. From reading your posts and perceiving you are not as defensively standing on this compared to TS2 comments, I gather you are oriented to supporting what currently exists in the BE, but also receptive to incremental change that doesn't work against any of the current schools and solidifies the eastern base. I don't want to interpret your views and you may further respond, but I did want to say how I perceive your thoughtful posts that often offer your historical perspective of how things developed in the BE. TS2's style will often include, coarse, negative language directed at anyone or any school or conference that he perceives, in any way, would invade or take something away from the current composition and commodities of the BE. His counter responses and advocacies that involve the eastern services academies, scheduling matters, bowls, TV, etc. can generate quick disagreements.
Lash is also a vigorous BE fan and frequent poster. While he can change perspectives frequently and confuse those not regularly following the discussion flow, his enthusiasm for the conference is obvious and sincere. The Big East boards are loaded with BE fans acting as change agents. Some of the ideas could startle even the most detached fan. That's all part of the chat.
We do know about the ACC raid on the BE. Even in the last several days, frequent posts have been made about which team the Big 10 would add, if not Notre Dame, should there be a Big 10 #12. For most, it is fun and total speculation concerning a matter that is not on the immediate horizon. As you know, a BE team is often mentioned.
As to the Penn State and the BE thing, I do not want to get into this. Again taking liberties again to speak for perhaps some others (and not to deliberately speak for Carolina Knights), I believe a point trying to be made is that had Penn State, as under-achieved as they were perceived in BB, been invited into the BB BE at the time, perhaps, just perhaps, the later resulting BE conference would have emerged with Penn State being included with perhaps a couple others that are currently not there having not left later. This view, is basically saying the schools that would ultimately compromise the collective BE could have been more visionary. I am not going to rehash the Pitt factor either, or the reasons Penn State now-a-days is not playing more of their old rivals OCC and who are now in the BE. However, even if Penn State BB was somehow embraced at the time, there is no assurance they would not have later opted for the Big 10, nor forestalled some kind of later ACC raid. Yes, things may have been different, but it is water over the dam and no use predicting "what ifs". The decision is part of the history of the BE, and people can read what they want into it as to the current BE mindset and the influence it may have had on the pattern of thinking that has since emerged. Some claim Penn State did not go about it the right way beforehand, so the arguments can go on and on. What happened, happened.
Have the Big East made mistakes in hindsight? Yes. Are mistakes unique to the Big East? Look at the WAC and MWC history.
As to Temple, maybe the MAC thing is the right answer for them for the time being. Former and retired bb coach Chaney who was openly against the school moving from the Atlantic 10 in bb worked against the "all-sports" association at Temple. Some posters are hoping the MAC connection will give the school time to improve their act.
Friarfan, you do offer a perspective on the Big East that offers a constructive reply to the more extreme perspectives in terms of future expansion. I would include the total embracing of the status quo for the long term as one of the extremes, for down the road, external factors, often unpredictable, can grow that can mandate change.