NCAA Conference Realignment & Expansion Message Boards
NCAA Map

Discussions by Conference:
  It is currently Wed Oct 22, 2014 4:39 am

Help support CollegeSportsInfo.com by shopping

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Relegation/Promotion
PostPosted: Mon May 18, 2009 11:23 pm 
Offline
Freshman
Freshman

Joined: Sun May 17, 2009 1:17 am
Posts: 8
I was playing around with some realignment thoughts the other day, and I decided to humor the concept of Relegation and Promotion. It's a pretty standard system worldwide and I think it could really work wonders in college sports!

The biggest hurdle, in my opinion, would be the separation of Basketball and Football. Some sports, like Hockey, already have their own conferences, and quite a few nonFBS programs already play in separate football/basketball conferences, so it wouldn't be a huge stretch.

For Basketball, there are 32 conferences, including independents. I decided to group them into four tiers, 8 conferences each. The top teams in each tier would be promoted to the next tier during the off season, and the bottom teams would be relegated to the next lower tier.

Since this would be done on a year by year basis, even if a storied program struggles one year (like Indiana this year) they would have the opportunity to jump back in the saddle if they are successful the next year. The same thing would go for a team like Drake, that might have one great year, but then falls back into obscurity... they would more than likely get relegated the next year.

Ultimately, the goal would be for the best teams to eventually all land in T1 conferences, with each tier stepping down in talent. This would create competitive basketball on all levels, rather than having teams like DePaul getting walked on year in and year out, and teams like Gonzaga or Memphis steamrolling their conferences on an annual basis.

With a relegation/promotion system, it'd work like this (I am using realtimepri.com's team/conference power rankings.)

T1 Conferences: ACC, Big 12, Big 10, Big East, SEC, Pac 10, Mountain West, Missouri Valley.
T2 Conferences: Atlantic 10, Conference USA, WAC, Horizon, MAAC, CAA, WCC, AEC
T3 Conferences: Sen Belt, Big West, Southern, Patriot, Southland, MAC, OVC, Big Sky
T4 Conferences: A-Sun, NEC, Big South, Summit, Ivy League, MEC, SWAC, Independents.

I'll promote/relegate the top/bottom 16 teams in each tier.

T1 -
Demoted to T2 - Airforce, Indiana, Colorado, Depaul, Colorado State, Indiana State, Iowa, South Florida, Oregon, Missouri State, Rutgers, Georgia, Oregon State, Southern Illinois, TCU, and Georgia Tech.
Promoted from T2 - Memphis, Gonzaga, Xavier, Utah State, Butler, Siena, Dayton, St. Mary's, Niagara, Temple, VCU, Tulsa, Cleveland State, Rhode Island, George Mason, and UAB

T2 -
Demoted from T1 - Airforce, Indiana, Colorado, Depaul, Colorado State, Indiana State, Iowa, South Florida, Oregon, Missouri State, Rutgers, Georgia, Oregon State, Southern Illinois, TCU, and Georgia Tech.
Promoted to T1 - Memphis, Gonzaga, Xavier, Utah State, Butler, Siena, Dayton, St. Mary's, Niagara, Temple, VCU, Tulsa, Cleveland State, Rhode Island, George Mason, and UAB
Demoted to T3 - Loyola Marymount, Pepperdine, Fordham, Hartford, Detroit, Maine, NC Wilmington, Valparaiso, San Francisco, Southern Methodist, Marist, Youngstown State, Georgia State, St. Peter's, William & Mary, and Rice.
Promoted from T3 - Davidson, Western Kentucky, American, Arkansas Little Rock, Charleston, Stephen F Austin, Buffalo, Weber State, Akron, Portland State, Miami (OH), North Texas, Tennessee Martin, South Alabama, Troy, and Navy.

T3 -
Demoted from T2 - Loyola Marymount, Pepperdine, Fordham, Hartford, Detroit, Maine, NC Wilmington, Valparaiso, San Francisco, Southern Methodist, Marist, Youngstown State, Georgia State, St. Peter's, William & Mary, and Rice.
Promoted to T2 - Davidson, Western Kentucky, American, Arkansas Little Rock, Charleston, Stephen F Austin, Buffalo, Weber State, Akron, Portland State, Miami (OH), North Texas, Tennessee Martin, South Alabama, Troy, and Navy.
Demoted to T4 - Sacramento State, SE Missouri State, Eastern Michigan, Toledo, Florida Atlantic, Central Arkansas, Northwestern State, Northern Illinois, Louisiana Lafayette, Cal Poly, Northern Arizona, Bucknell, NcNeese State, Western Michigan, Colgate, and Louisisana Monroe.
Promoted from T4 - North Dakota State, Robert Morris, VMI, E. Tennesse State, Cornell, Morgan State, Belmont, Mount St. Mary's, Radford, Oakland, Liberty, Jacksonville, Alabama State, Oral Roberts, Sacred Heart, Mercer

T4 -
Demoted from T3 - Sacramento State, SE Missouri State, Eastern Michigan, Toledo, Florida Atlantic, Central Arkansas, Northwestern State, Northern Illinois, Louisiana Lafayette, Cal Poly, Northern Arizona, Bucknell, NcNeese State, Western Michigan, Colgate, and Louisisana Monroe.
Promoted to T3 - North Dakota State, Robert Morris, VMI, E. Tennesse State, Cornell, Morgan State, Belmont, Mount St. Mary's, Radford, Oakland, Liberty, Jacksonville, Alabama State, Oral Roberts, Sacred Heart, Mercer
Demoted to D2 - NJIT, NC Central, Winston-Salem, Maryland Eastern Shore, Kennesaw State, Houston Baptist, High Point, St. Francis (PA), Western Illinois, Texas Pan American, North Florida, Charleston Southern, Farleigh Dickinson, Howard, Missouri Kansas City, Monmouth
Promoted from D2 - Findlay, C.W. Post, BYU-Hawaii, Augusta State, Gannon, Central Missouri, Southwest Baptist, Metropolitan State, Northern Kentucky, Claflin, Florida Southern, Southwest Minnesota, Central Oklahoma, Benedict, Cristian Brothers, and USC Aiken.



Again, Football and Basketball would have to separate themselves (which in my opinion, should be done anyway to create better competition... it's tragic that teams like Indiana bring down the conference football strength for the sake of having a traditionally great hoops program, or teams like Iowa that are great in football, but lower the conference basketball strength.)

Here is how it would look for football

T1 conferences: Big 12, SEC, Big East, ACC, Big 10, Pac 10
T2 conferences: MWC, WAC, CUSA, MAC, Independent, Sun Belt

T1 -
Demoted to T2 - Washington, Washington State, Iowa State, Indiana, Michigan, Syracuse
Promoted from T2 - Utah, TCU, Boise State, BYU, Tulsa, Rice

T2 -
Demoted from T1 - Washington, Washington State, Iowa State, Indiana, Michigan, Syracuse
Promoted to T1 - Utah, TCU, Boise State, BYU, Tulsa, Rice
Demoted to FCS - North Texas, Idaho, Miami (OH), SMU, Tulane, Western Kentucky
Promoted from FCS - James Madison, Richmond, Montana, Villanova, Appalachian State, Northern Iowa.


With the lack of a football playoff, this would really make things legit. Teams from nonBCS conferences would have the chance to join the big boys, and BCS bottom feeders would get their BCS welfare checks ripped out of their hands. For football and basketball alike, it would allow the money to go to the teams that deserve it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Relegation/Promotion
PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 12:10 pm 
Online
CollegeSportsInfo Admin
CollegeSportsInfo Admin
User avatar

Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am
Posts: 3811
Beyond the problem of football vs basketball, i think the bigger problem is the economics.

Each conference operates as it's own business. So the Pac 10 plays by a different set of rules than the WAC or Big West. The only way you can have a relegation system would be to LUMP all the schools together, break down into groups (now called conferences) and then run with it. It's a big step that will happen about 50 years after there are FBS Playoffs.

_________________
Image

Image@ncaasports Image csi.com/facebook

Image
Like the new CSI Userbar? Feel free to use it here and any other forums.
You can save and host it yourself or link from here.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Relegation/Promotion
PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2009 4:42 pm 
Offline
Senior
Senior

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 11:15 pm
Posts: 261
Location: Louisville, KY
Quinn wrote:
Beyond the problem of football vs basketball, i think the bigger problem is the economics.

Each conference operates as it's own business. So the Pac 10 plays by a different set of rules than the WAC or Big West. The only way you can have a relegation system would be to LUMP all the schools together, break down into groups (now called conferences) and then run with it. It's a big step that will happen about 50 years after there are FBS Playoffs.


That and you have to take into account that no one in America is ready for a relegation/promotional system. There's no way you'll be able to get people to pay money into a team that could be sent down to AAA or AA level at the drop of a hat, so it's a matter of getting the country behind that type of system, which I seriously doubt would ever happen.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Relegation/Promotion
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:17 pm 
Offline
All-Conference
All-Conference

Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:21 pm
Posts: 882
The key to "promotion/relegation" working in a college environment would be schedule and geography.

You'd basically need separate "leagues" for football and all other sports.

Second, you need four geographic conferences at each level (West, South, East, Central)
Your regions would be slightly exaggerated due to geography, the West would need to be the Mississippi River West, the south has FL, NC, SC, GA, AL, MS, North from NC up through PA to Maine, and the Central IL, IN, MI, WI, KY, TN, OH. Might have to split a state like Virginia to get even distribution of teams.

Third, you need to schedule to play only teams in your region/level; which means 17 teams per level (no conf. tourneys; 32 games). So that's five levels with four regions each.

Fourth, you need a tournament format like English Soccer plays: where the top teams each level, in each region advance to the national tournament at then end for basketball/other sports.

Level One: Top six in each region go to tourney (24)
Level Two: Top four (16)
Level Three: Top three (12)
Level Four: Top two (8)
Level Five: Top team (4)

Fifth, you need a TV revenue structure that makes financial sense for more people. You'd be eliminating conferences and relying on the classification for TV contracts.

Really, it's not so much segregation of schools into a class system as it is a scheduling model/conference realignment. The top 72 teams in this format wouldn't be all that different from the top 72 in the country, with some geographical outliers. And the money would be about the same. If you consider the total of the BCS conferences TV deals, then divide that out 72 ways, the cut is about the same.

What it DOES provide is the opportunity for MORE lower-level teams to gain access (20 bids for the bottom two levels is about the same, but conference tournament doesn't matter so if you're the best at your level, you are in); AND upward mobility in TV revenue for schools like Gonzaga or Xavier or Memphis.

The benefit to big money teams is that your schedule is set by performance, not paying little guys to come get a whoopin. This would cut costs. And "staying up" would be akin to performance for revenue. Take Vanderbilt for example. They collect $18 million from the SEC and are relevant in basketball every 10 years or so. This would bump them down to the second level and let someone like Memphis grab that loot until they stop being good.

Of course, instead of "conference unfairness" it's geographic unfairness.

_________________
1897-1898 | 1900-06 | 1926-27 | 1929-30 | 1939 | 1942


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Relegation/Promotion
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:36 pm 
Offline
All-Conference
All-Conference

Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:21 pm
Posts: 882
The key to "promotion/relegation" working in a college environment would be schedule and geography.

You'd basically need separate "leagues" for football and all other sports.

Second, you need four geographic conferences at each level (West, South, East, Central)
Your regions would be slightly exaggerated due to geography, the West would need to be the Mississippi River West, the south has FL, NC, SC, GA, AL, MS, North from NC up through PA to Maine, and the Central IL, IN, MI, WI, KY, TN, OH. Might have to split a state like Virginia to get even distribution of teams.

Third, you need to schedule to play only teams in your region/level; which means 17 teams per level (no conf. tourneys; 32 games). So that's five levels with four regions each.

Fourth, you need a tournament format like English Soccer plays: where the top teams each level, in each region advance to the national tournament at then end for basketball/other sports.

Level One: Top six in each region go to tourney (24)
Level Two: Top four (16)
Level Three: Top three (12)
Level Four: Top two (8)
Level Five: Top team (4)

Fifth, you need a TV revenue structure that makes financial sense for more people. You'd be eliminating conferences and relying on the classification for TV contracts.

Really, it's not so much segregation of schools into a class system as it is a scheduling model/conference realignment. The top 72 teams in this format wouldn't be all that different from the top 72 in the country, with some geographical outliers. And the money would be about the same. If you consider the total of the BCS conferences TV deals, then divide that out 72 ways, the cut is about the same.

What it DOES provide is the opportunity for MORE lower-level teams to gain access (20 bids for the bottom two levels is about the same, but conference tournament doesn't matter so if you're the best at your level, you are in); AND upward mobility in TV revenue for schools like Gonzaga or Xavier or Memphis.

The benefit to big money teams is that your schedule is set by performance, not paying little guys to come get a whoopin. This would cut costs. And "staying up" would be akin to performance for revenue. Take Vanderbilt for example. They collect $18 million from the SEC and are relevant in basketball every 10 years or so. This would bump them down to the second level and let someone like Memphis grab that loot until they stop being good.

Of course, instead of "conference unfairness" it's geographic unfairness.

_________________
1897-1898 | 1900-06 | 1926-27 | 1929-30 | 1939 | 1942


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
 

 

cron




Looking for College Sports apparel? Support our partner:








Support Our Partners: Search Engine Marketing - Search Engine Optimization - Search Engine Training - Online Marketing for Restuarants

Subway Map Shirts - Food and Travel

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group