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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Realignment
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 1:34 pm 
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There have been recent discussions by the Great West football conference about expanding to all sports. This came to be known with UT-PA seeking a conference home.

From CollegeSportsInfo.com: UTPA Seeks Home / Great West Expansion

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Last edited by Quinn on Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 1:34 pm 
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I would love to see the Summit and a potential Great West consider some reshuffling of schools. My factor is more based on location. The Dakotas are all making the push to D1. I do think that for the sake of the region and potential success for all, they really should be all together.

GREAT WEST:

North Dakota
South Dakota
North Dakota State
South Dakota State
Southern Utah
Western Illinois
* Cal Poly (football only)
* UC Davis (football only)

Full members without football:
Utah Valley St.
IUPUI
Oakland
IPFW


This new Great West conference (could be Summit but it's easier for schools to LEAVE a conference than for a conference to kickout some members) would range from the midwest of Michigan/Indiana/Illinois, north to the Dakotas and West to Utah. As for travel, there are sensible partners involved. And for road trips, a school could play multiple opponents with limited travel:
North Dakota & NDSU
South Dakota & SDSU
southern Utah & Utah Valley St.
IPFW/IUPUI/Oakland
with Western illinois in the middle of the three eastern schools and those in South Dakota




As for the Summit...

The Summit League would take more of a southern feel with 8 full-time members and no football members:

Summit League:
Oral Roberts
UMKC
Centenary
*Dallas Baptist
*Houston Baptist
*UT Pan American
*Oklahoma City
*Tarelton St.



Other Schools potentially looking for homes:
Seattle (eventually will be in the WCC)
Cal St. Bakersfield (will be in Big West)
Chicago St: if they were still in the summit, I'm sure they would force the Great West to take them. But they are gone and the Summit members aren't crying
Hawai'i Hilo
Savannah St
Longwood
NJ Tech

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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 2:42 pm 
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UTPA seems to be a natural fit for the Southland Conference, once some of those schools leave for FBS conferences (Texas St, UTSA, Lamar). I think most of the current independents will find homes in better conferences than a start-up conference would be.


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 5:32 pm 
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UTPA should be #1 on the Southland's radar once the FBS upgrades start happening-they are already a Division I school. Also, unlike Houston Baptist, Dallas Baptist, and even Centenary, UTPA is a public school. Even if Arkansas-Little Rock and New Orleans join the Southland from the Sun Belt, UTPA should get in for sure if three schools leave the Southland.

Southland (*no football)
West - UALR*, Texas-Pan American*, Texas-Arlington*, Texas A&M-Corpus Christi*, Sam Houston State, Stephen F. Austin State
East - Central Arkansas, McNeese State, Nicholls State, Northwestern State, Southeastern Louisiana, New Orleans*

That still leaves 7 for football even if no one else picks up an FCS pigskin.

The best chance for the Great West to become an all-sports conference would be for the Summit to expand to 12, wait five seasons, and then split 6-6:

Great West: (*non-football member)
North Dakota State (from Summit/Missouri Valley Football)
South Dakota State (from Summit/Missouri Valley Football)
*Utah Valley (from Summit)
Southern Utah (other sports from Summit)
*Denver (from Summit via Sun Belt)
*Oral Roberts (from Summit)
Oklahoma City (post-split expansion; from Division II)
North Dakota (post-split expansion; other sports from Independent)
South Dakota (post-split expansion; other sports from Independent)
*Seattle (from independent)
Cal Poly-SLO (football only)
California-Davis (football only)

The only odd couple for travel purposes are Denver and Seattle.

Summit:
Centenary
Missouri-Kansas City
Western Illinois
IPFW
IUPUI
Oakland
Texas-Pan American (post-split expansion; from Independent)
Houston Baptist (post-split expansion; from Independent)

Western Illiniois is the only school that plays football, and they do that in the Missouri Valley Football Conference. This might have a better chance at attracting new members (such as a Bellarmine, Northern Kentucky, or Central Missouri) than the existing Summit League.


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:02 pm 
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Ideally, the North Central conference (d2) would have upgraded to D1 as a whole. but the NCAA has a 13 year postseason ban on conference upgrades, so only the Dakota St. schools upgraded followed years later by UND and USD.

The Great West and the (4) Dakota schools already upgrading should consider feelers to some of the former NCC schools. It seems asinine when the NCC should have been allowed to simply upgrade collectively. But the rules are in place. And those rules would allow the Great West to sponsor all-sports and hopefully get an autobid. All they need to do is invite some of the NCC schools...if they were to upgrade.

North Dakota
North Dakota St.
south Dakota
south Dakota St.
Minnesota St.
Minnesota - Duluth
Nebraska - Omaha
St. Could St.
* Cal Poly (football only)
* UC Davis (football only)

Want more than (8), fine, consider any of the following. I'd have to think that a couple of them would bolt the Summit for the Great West:

Southern Utah
Western Illinois
Utah Valley St.
IUPUI
Oakland
IPFW

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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:31 am 
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It seems silly for Chicago St or NJIT (or even Longwood) to join a conference called the Great West. The transportation costs for all six school would be enormous.

If the conference needs three schools to go with UTPA, North Dakota, and South Dakota, they should look at:


Utah Valley
Southern Utah
Denver


Utah Valley has struck out so far trying to get into any conference.

Southern Utah wants the Big Sky but has been repeatdely denied.

And both Southern Utah and Denver are not good geographical fits in their current conferences (the Summit and Sun Belt respectively).

If Southern Utah and Denver are willing to give up an automatic bid for a while in order to play in a conference that suits them better in the long-term, the conference could have the 6 teams they need all within a reasonable geographic area.

And down the line, they could look at other schools, such as New Mexico State (if they get kicked out of the FBS and the WAC), Houston Baptist (once they become D-I eligible) and North Dakota State and South Dakota State (once the conference gets an automatic bid)


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 10:39 am 
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I don't think the Southland will take non-football members in the future. Corpus Christi all but promised them football but now seem to be backing away.


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Sat Jun 21, 2008 11:55 am 
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I don't see the XDSU's leaving what they have now.

And rumors out of KC are that UMKC may decide it has failed in D-I and may drop back down to D-II.

Central Missouri Is not going D-I either...They are perfectly happy where they are right now.


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:39 pm 
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It looks like the ball is rolling on the Great West All Sports Conference.

http://kgbt4.com/sports/sports_story.aspx?id=156342


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 11:06 am 
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It's a go: 6 teams thus far, possibly 2 more to follow with Seattle and Chicago St.

http://collegesportsinfo.com/blog/2008/07/great-west-all-sports-conference.html

Official Membership:
Utah Valley
North Dakota
South Dakota
Texas Pan American
Houston Baptist
New Jersey Institute of Technology.

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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 5:41 pm 
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Travel....ouch.


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:13 am 
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OK, this is an expedient [at least short-term] solution for some independents, but WHAT THE **** is NJIT THINKING ?

How can they afford this travel ? Is "all-sports" really only basketball ?
For a round trip to some of these places, their athletes may have to change planes twice in each direction (6 legs per round trip). How can this possibly be a workable proposition for them ?

If it's for BB only, then they have a double round-robin for a shot at an AQ (down the road) to to the NCAA basketball "big dance" tourney money... So if the conference grows to 8, that's 7 long trips for a 1/8 shot at tourney money.... hmmm.... is that their "carrot" ?
You'd think that for other sports, staying independent and taking bus trips to east coast schools makes a lot more sense in terms of time and money....

IF this conference achieved stability after several years, this might be a reasonable home for:
Southern Utah
Denver
Oklahoma City

If Southern Utah left the Summit, the Summit might then rationalize their geography by going to 12 with the addition of NDU, SDU, and Chicago State.

That might leave the Great West with:
Seattle
SUU
Utah Valley
Denver
UTPA
Houston Baptist
Ok City.

That's not so ridiculous from a travel stand-point (Seattle would be the out-lier).

But NJIT travelling to Texas, Seattle, Dakotas, and Utah seems to be beyond brutal, and I can't believe their membership in this group can last very long....


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 12:59 pm 
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I'm happy for these schools that they've finally found a conference home. But it feels like there is a lot of work left for this conference to do if it is going to maintain itself in the long term. Seattle and Chicago State are rumored to be joining next, which would give them eight basketball schools. But how long all eight will stay in the conference is a big question.

Seattle - desperately wants to join the WCC

NJIT - how long can they maintain these travel costs for?

Chicago State - not as bad a travel cost situation as NJIT, but still not good

South Dakota and North Dakota - it's hard to picture them not ultimately joining the same conference as SDSU and NDSU for rivalry purposes

UTPA and Houston Baptist - potential Southland candidates should any current Southland schools go FBS in football and join the Sun Belt

Utah Valley - could be a potential addition to the Summit as a travel partner for Southern Utah depending on how things shake out



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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 1:43 pm 
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This new Great West Conference could be short-lived; I could see a merger with the Summit League in the near future based on some reshuffling of schools. Here's some speculation:

* Missouri Valley adds Butler, Loyola (Chi) from Horizon Leage
* Horizon adds IUPUI, IPFW, Oakland from Summit and Chicago State from Great West
* America East adds NJIT from Great West
* Ohio Valley adds Western Illinois from Summit
* Remaining 6 Summit and 6 Great West schools merge into Summit League.


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 Post subject: GREAT WEST Expansion
PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 2:22 pm 
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NJIT tried the America East already and was turned down.
NJIT almost got into the NEC,but the NEC chose Bryant.


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