Who Owns a Folded Conference's Name Rights?

Quinn · **Joined:** Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am **Posts:** 3757

The Big East situation remains a hot topic on these forums. There are a few scebarios discussed but most center around a split between football schools and non-football schools.

One of the issues that we've looked at has been the potential names for a new conference and who would get the new name. This got me thinking about "retired" conference names.

So let's say a split happens and the football schools leave, get a new TV contract and have to name their new conference, leaving "Big East" for the basketball schools. When you look at the schools involved, half are in major cities:

Pittsburgh
Louisville
Cincinnati
South Florida (Tampa)
and then Syracuse, Rutgers, WVU and UConn. Only WVU gets the real rural label as UConn plays it's games in Hartford and Rutgers is in the densely populated state of NJ. So really, like the basketball schools, the football schools are fairly urban.

So in the naming ideas, one that i threw out there years ago was the "Metro East" for whomever lost the Big East name. But I started thinking: what about the Metro Conference?

The conference used to exist and ended with the formation of Conference USA. But the name is out there. Usually, that means it's gone for good. Or is it?

What are the ownership criteria for naming rights of an former conference?

The Metro Conference had (6) charter members:
# Cincinnati (1975-91)
# Georgia Tech (1975-78)
# Louisville (1975-95)
# Memphis (1975-91)
# Saint Louis (1975-82)
# Tulane (1975-95)

See where I'm going here...

If the Big East football 8 left, and added Memphis, they would have 3 of the 6 Metro conference charter members.

I wonder how difficult it would be to just take that Metro name? From a branding perspective, it's a homerun in it's simplicity...

tarkiokid · **Posted:** Tue Mar 10, 2009 5:29 pm

I don't think that the football BE members are going to let the name go, not only because of the possibility of being written out of the BCS berth, but because of the basketball prestige the name has. While Memphis would be a logical fit and brings solid basketball, they need some serious facility upgrades for football before they're considered, and they haven't shown much intention of doing that anytime soon.

JPSchmack · **Joined:** Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:21 pm **Posts:** 851

The Big East name is one reason I don't foresee a split anytime soon.

The odds would be on the Big East football schools buying the name from the charter members, who I believe own the rights. Part of the deal would probably include be some kind of scheduling agreement, maybe a Big East-"East Coast Conference" challenge or something.

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:18 pm

I think the FB schools would get the Big East name.

East Coast Conf. won't work because the East Coast Conf. is a D-II conf. already.

I think the non-fb schools should be called the Private Athletic Conf. since they are all private and if they added 2 schools to get to 10 I bet Xavier would be 1, Butler or Dayton 2. All private schools.

dafoeberezin3494 · **Posted:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 12:03 am

Fresno St. Alum wrote:

I think the FB schools would get the Big East name.

East Coast Conf. won't work because the East Coast Conf. is a D-II conf. already.

I think the non-fb schools should be called the Private Athletic Conf. since they are all private and if they added 2 schools to get to 10 I bet Xavier would be 1, Butler or Dayton 2. All private schools.

If the 8 non-fb schools stayed together and depending on who they added (Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis?) they might remain all-Catholic as well as all-private. Would "Catholic Conference" work, or would these schools want to downplay that aspect from a marketing perspective (I have not heard of a conference yet that mentions a religion in its title)? Also, if Butler was one of the schools the conference would not be all-Catholic. Another possibility might be "Eastern Athletic Conference" although I bet most schools would not go for that (too much parallel to the WAC, a less prestigious BB conference).

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 2:13 pm

EAC is also almost the same as AEC

Catholic Conf. would work too. I didn't know Dayton was Catholic

JPSchmack · **Joined:** Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:21 pm **Posts:** 851

dafoeberezin3494 wrote:

If the 8 non-fb schools stayed together and depending on who they added (Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis?) they might remain all-Catholic as well as all-private.

Seven. Notre Dame is going with the football schools for all sports, while maintaining FB Independence.

Quinn · **Joined:** Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am **Posts:** 3757

dafoeberezin3494 wrote:

Fresno St. Alum wrote:

I think the FB schools would get the Big East name.

East Coast Conf. won't work because the East Coast Conf. is a D-II conf. already.

I think the non-fb schools should be called the Private Athletic Conf. since they are all private and if they added 2 schools to get to 10 I bet Xavier would be 1, Butler or Dayton 2. All private schools.

If the 8 non-fb schools stayed together and depending on who they added (Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis?) they might remain all-Catholic as well as all-private. Would "Catholic Conference" work, or would these schools want to downplay that aspect from a marketing perspective (I have not heard of a conference yet that mentions a religion in its title)? Also, if Butler was one of the schools the conference would not be all-Catholic. Another possibility might be "Eastern Athletic Conference" although I bet most schools would not go for that (too much parallel to the WAC, a less prestigious BB conference).

There's a better chance that the conference name would be Ass Shit Crap League. There is NOOOOOO way that a conference would EVER use a single religious affiliation in the name, especially Catholic (as opposed to Protestant), when it would alienate so many others (potential consumers for the broadcast sponsors). Just ain't gonna happen. You've had the WCC that's been all Catholic and the WCc name has done plenty fine.

Quinn · **Joined:** Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am **Posts:** 3757

JPSchmack wrote:

dafoeberezin3494 wrote:

If the 8 non-fb schools stayed together and depending on who they added (Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis?) they might remain all-Catholic as well as all-private.

Seven. Notre Dame is going with the football schools for all sports, while maintaining FB Independence.

In theory, there's a chance. But if Notre Dame is still indy for football, their interests are best served with the non-football schools. they provide the markets Notre Dame wants, especially NYC and Chicago where the majority of ND alum reside.

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Mon Mar 23, 2009 8:54 pm

The ASCL would be awesome :lol:

So my Private Athletic Conf. would still work? If not we could go with Private Parts Athletic Conf. so the pulic schools won't feel so bad.

Quinn · **Joined:** Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am **Posts:** 3757

I'm actually throwing something together about the common misconceptions about schools and their affiliations. The focus is on how schools commonly with a name incorporating a city are often catholic schools (UoSan diego, Uoportland, Saint Louis U, etc). But while they are catholic schools, people commonly don't know they are unless you are from the are, in a career of academia or a sports fan.

But in addition to the WCC you have the MAAC. So conferences based on an affiliation arent uncommon. But to incorporate the name of the religion would be an extreme negative in the marketing sense. You're not going to attract to many non-catholic fans with a name like the Catholic conference, etc. Luckily the name Catholic League already exists but not for sports.

JPSchmack · **Joined:** Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:21 pm **Posts:** 851

Quinn wrote:

JPSchmack wrote:

dafoeberezin3494 wrote:

If the 8 non-fb schools stayed together and depending on who they added (Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis?) they might remain all-Catholic as well as all-private.

Seven. Notre Dame is going with the football schools for all sports, while maintaining FB Independence.

In theory, there's a chance. But if Notre Dame is still indy for football, their interests are best served with the non-football schools. they provide the markets Notre Dame wants, especially NYC and Chicago where the majority of ND alum reside.

Their football team has a NATIONAL TV contract. Why would the their non-football sports need big markets for? Only basketball would. There IS no market for volleyball, women's soccer, etc.

Notre Dame will go with Pitt, UConn and Syracuse if the Big East splits in half. It provides much better competition than the other group across the board in Olympic sports, and that's where the money is going to go.

Just like when they left the Great Midwest for the Big East. They followed the money, even though geography and traditional rivalries were left behind. The want a "BCS" conference for their other sports, and the Big East football schools give them the best opportunity.

Quinn · **Joined:** Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am **Posts:** 3757

I agree with your theory. I just recall when the 2003 shakeup was happening and the idea of a split was just about coming to fruition, Notre Dame was expected to remain with the basketball schools.

Why? All the basics I mentioned such as the northeast markets (again, the largest markets for Notre Dame alumni are New York and Chicago) and the association with similar minded religious and academic schools. Also factor in the lack of pressure to join for all-sports by remaining with the basketball schools since there would be no football. Lastly, what's to say that the football schools even want an non-football member?

JPSchmack · **Joined:** Sat Mar 21, 2009 10:21 pm **Posts:** 851

Quinn wrote:

I agree with your theory. I just recall when the 2003 shakeup was happening and the idea of a split was just about coming to fruition, Notre Dame was expected to remain with the basketball schools.

Why? All the basics I mentioned such as the northeast markets (again, the largest markets for Notre Dame alumni are New York and Chicago) and the association with similar minded religious and academic schools. Also factor in the lack of pressure to join for all-sports by remaining with the basketball schools since there would be no football. Lastly, what's to say that the football schools even want an non-football member?

I don't think Notre Dame was expected to at all. There was no chance Kevin White moved Notre Dame in with basketball (He came from Tulane and saw what leaving the SEC to be with "like minded academic schools" did for their sports).

The association with schools of "similar budget" is more likely than "similar minded academic and religious."

Academically it doesn't get any better than the Ivy, but you think Notre Dame athletics would join that conference?

It's all about the (1) money and (2) the NCAA championship access. In the long run, leaving Marquette, DePaul and Xavier (catholic, regional rivals) back in the day was worth it because of the exposure the Big East brought.

Their non-revenue programs would lose A LOT from going with the basketball schools. And when you think about it, the basketball league is going to lose a lot too without Syracuse and UConn unless ESPN is behind the conference. If ESPN doesn't promote that league like they do the Big East, it becomes nothing but what the A-10 was from 1995-2001: The second best basketball league in the east coast. Look how their exposure and rep has dwindled.

And the football schools would want Notre Dame for the same reason the Big East wants Notre Dame now. They are Notre freaking Dame. They are rich, competitive in non-revenue sports, and there's a chance it leads to football games on their schedule at some point. They've always held out hope ND would join for football too.

dafoeberezin3494 · **Posted:** Tue Mar 24, 2009 6:39 pm

Quinn wrote:

dafoeberezin3494 wrote:

If the 8 non-fb schools stayed together and depending on who they added (Xavier, Dayton, St. Louis?) they might remain all-Catholic as well as all-private. Would "Catholic Conference" work, or would these schools want to downplay that aspect from a marketing perspective (I have not heard of a conference yet that mentions a religion in its title)? Also, if Butler was one of the schools the conference would not be all-Catholic. Another possibility might be "Eastern Athletic Conference" although I bet most schools would not go for that (too much parallel to the WAC, a less prestigious BB conference).

There's a better chance that the conference name would be Ass Shit Crap League. There is NOOOOOO way that a conference would EVER use a single religious affiliation in the name, especially Catholic (as opposed to Protestant), when it would alienate so many others (potential consumers for the broadcast sponsors). Just ain't gonna happen. You've had the WCC that's been all Catholic and the WCC name has done plenty fine.

I thought this response was rather harsh, especially because I considered the possibility that the name "Catholic Conference" wouldn't work (I agree with Quinn that it would severely damage their marketability). So what names would work for a potential conference formed by half the Big East?

[*]Metro Conference: simple, formely existed and once included several current Big East members (did we ever answer the original question of this thread- who owns a folded conference's name rights?)
[*]Private Athletic Conference: FSA's suggestion
[*]Eastern Athletic Conference: my suggestion

Does anyone else have any good name ideas, or can anyone answer the original question of this thread?

Who Owns a Folded Conference's Name Rights?

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