Summit League Expansion

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Thu Nov 18, 2010 1:16 am

dbackjon wrote:

Sure they could...

Jacksonville State goes FBS to the SunBelt.

OVC adds WIU for all sports

Youngstown State goes FBS, leaves the Horizon, prompting the Horizon to add Oakland, IPFW and IUPUI (better fit, anyways)

That leaves the Summit with 5 members - three Dakotas, ORU and UMKC.

The OVC has an opening with 11 members now and they don't use it on WIU, UNA is the only name I am hearing about with OVC expansion.

Youngstown St. to the MAC was big news in 1991. Not now. I do think if anyone leaves the Horizon it would be Butler to the A-10 if UNCC joins the Sun Belt or Temple Joins CUSA if UCF goes to the BE.

I think IUPUI would replace the Indianapolis area school lost to the A-10. That puts the Summit at 8. UNO & Bellarmine would put them back at 10. If for some reason they have a change of heart HBU, UTPA or Chicago St. could do the same.

UALR might be an option for the Summit if the SBC decides football is a requirement.

freaked4collegefb · **Joined:** Tue Jun 13, 2006 2:37 pm **Posts:** 7048

Omaha World Herald reporting that Summit league is visiting the UNO campus today and tomorrow.Link at http://www.omaha.com/article/20110309/N ... 3099866/-1

freaked4collegefb · **Joined:** Tue Jun 13, 2006 2:37 pm **Posts:** 7048

Another article,this one from the Dakotas,discussing Summit league interest in UNO at http://www.argusleader.com/article/2011 ... Sports%7Cs

tute79 · **Joined:** Fri Jun 23, 2006 4:25 pm **Posts:** 1490

So I'm guessing this will unfold as follows.

UNO will say: "sounds good, what about our football team ?"

The only acceptable resonse is if the MVFC will expand and accept UNO. The MVFC is currently at 10, and doesn't want 11.
Is the MVFC willing to expand to 12 ? Must be, or the Summit wouldn't bother making overtures to UNO at this point.

So if UNO comes aboard as #11 to the MVFC, who would be #12 ?
The obvious answer is North Dakota. The just agreed to join the Big Sky for all sports, but really wanted the Summit / MVFC combo.
The Big Sky got stuck at an odd number when South Dakota got the Summit ? MVFC combo at the 11th hour.

The Summit Commish (Tom Douple) said "we are looking at several schools" - the Summit will be at 9 when SUU and Centenary leave and South Dakota comes aboard.
I see them adding UNO, North Dakota, and a non-FB school to go to 12.

The Big Sky may let North Dakota go without an exit fee, since they were up front about preferring the Summit / MVFC (to join the other 3 Dakota schools),
and it gets the Big Sky back to even numbers (10 + 2 Big West associate FB members).

So the UNO / North Dakota moves would get the Summit to 11, the MVFC to 12, and the Big Sky to 10+2.
The Summit would want to get to 10 or 12 for other sports.
Subtract one - is Oral Roberts getting overtures from the Southland ?
Add one - is UALR (the only non-FB school int he SunBelt) seeing a need to move elsewhere ?
Those might be likely moves.

Now go down to D-2. If UNO leaves the MIAA (who just expanded to 16 - 8 in Missouri, and 8 in NE, KS, OK), who would they look to, to replace UNO ?
I think logical candidates could be OK Panhandle State (Lonestar Conference) or Wayne St. (NSIC) or Chadron St. (RMAC).
Either of the latter 2 moves could open up a spot for S Dak School of Mines (not currently on the RMAC invitation list).

dbackjon · **Joined:** Mon Mar 16, 2009 9:50 pm **Posts:** 267

Big Sky Commissioner Fullerton has already indicated that UND would not be penalized if they got a Summit/MVFC invite before they officially join in 2012. After that, then it will be different.

86mets · **Joined:** Tue Dec 14, 2010 2:22 pm **Posts:** 58

UND, UNO and UALR all would be good fits for Summit/MVFC (minus UALR)

For Summit travel it sets up nicely w/ logical road partners, thus saving $$$ for a league that was too far flung w/ SUU

Oakland-IUPUFW
IUPUI-Western Ill
UND-NDSU
USD-SDSU
UNO-UMKC
Oral Roberts-UALR

Note: If UALR could not work, Texas-Arlington would be a good addition and fit right into the above arrangement.

If Denver decided the WAC is too unstable, they could be plugged in leiu of UALR. Denver already has major hockey rivalries w/ UND and UNO and is near enough to Tulsa and KC.

With Denver travel could be:
Oakland-IUPUFW
IUPUI-Western Ill
UND-NDSU
USD-SDSU
DU-UNO
Oral Roberts-UMKC

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Wed Mar 09, 2011 5:56 pm

tute79 wrote:

So I'm guessing this will unfold as follows.

UNO will say: "sounds good, what about our football team ?"

The only acceptable resonse is if the MVFC will expand and accept UNO. The MVFC is currently at 10, and doesn't want 11.
Is the MVFC willing to expand to 12 ? Must be, or the Summit wouldn't bother making overtures to UNO at this point.

So if UNO comes aboard as #11 to the MVFC, who would be #12 ?
The obvious answer is North Dakota. The just agreed to join the Big Sky for all sports, but really wanted the Summit / MVFC combo.
The Big Sky got stuck at an odd number when South Dakota got the Summit ? MVFC combo at the 11th hour.

The Summit Commish (Tom Douple) said "we are looking at several schools" - the Summit will be at 9 when SUU and Centenary leave and South Dakota comes aboard.
I see them adding UNO, North Dakota, and a non-FB school to go to 12.

The Big Sky may let North Dakota go without an exit fee, since they were up front about preferring the Summit / MVFC (to join the other 3 Dakota schools),
and it gets the Big Sky back to even numbers (10 + 2 Big West associate FB members).

So the UNO / North Dakota moves would get the Summit to 11, the MVFC to 12, and the Big Sky to 10+2.
The Summit would want to get to 10 or 12 for other sports.
Subtract one - is Oral Roberts getting overtures from the Southland ?
Add one - is UALR (the only non-FB school int he SunBelt) seeing a need to move elsewhere ?
Those might be likely moves.

Now go down to D-2. If UNO leaves the MIAA (who just expanded to 16 - 8 in Missouri, and 8 in NE, KS, OK), who would they look to, to replace UNO ?
I think logical candidates could be OK Panhandle State (Lonestar Conference) or Wayne St. (NSIC) or Chadron St. (RMAC).
Either of the latter 2 moves could open up a spot for S Dak School of Mines (not currently on the RMAC invitation list).

OPSU has no shot of a MIAA invite. Think of the MIAA as the SEC, think of OPSU as Lamar. Chadron St. is way on the west end of Neb. so they have no shot. Geography matters in D-II. I don't think Wayne St.(NE) is a real option either. They could go after one of the better D-II Arkansas schools, William Jewell or a top NAIA school like Missouri Valley, MidAmerica Nazarene. However the MIAA has Lincoln who was a long time member that dropped football, left, then brought it back and came back. They suck, think of them as Vanderbilt.

UALR isn't being pushed out like Denver was since they have enough core SBC sports and they're in the heart of the footprint. So what advantage would to be for them to leave? Yes it would make for a neat fit for us conf. movement guys, but they don't care about us.

tute79 · **Joined:** Fri Jun 23, 2006 4:25 pm **Posts:** 1490

So Fresno -

I never heard officially that the MIAA split into divisions, but I assume the thinking was that it would be announced before Lindenwood and UNKearney came aboard.
Would you agree the thinking was that the 8 Missouri schools form "the East" and the NE,KS,OK schools form "the West" ?
If so, what are your candidate schools to replace a departing "West" member ?

Are you thinking a 9th Missouri school (and have one slide to the West) ?
Or a school in Western Arkansas (to the West) ?
Plausible...

I agree Chadron is way out west - a problem. OPSU is out west too....
What's the story with Wayne State (I know little about them....)
Could they go after a SD member of the NSIC like Augustana ?

Thanks,
Tute

filbert · **Joined:** Sun Nov 09, 2003 9:16 pm **Posts:** 31

Additional confirmation of Summit site visit to Nebraska-Omaha:

http://www.argusleader.com/article/20110310/SPORTS0202/103100313/Crowds-up-slightly-Summit-event-ESPNU-scoreboard-fall-short?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|Sports

Quote:

Less than 24 hours after wrapping up the conference basketball tournament at the Arena, Summit League officials zipped down I-29 to make a site visit at prospect member Nebraska-Omaha on Wednesday.

The university currently competes on the Division II level but is reportedly mulling a move to Division I after an NCAA moratorium ends this summer and has longstanding ties with current Summit members SDSU and NDSU and future member USD.

"We're going to visit with athletic staff and administration and sort of see what their thoughts are and do a really good once-over for that institution," Summit commissioner Tom Douple said. "We have a lot of information that they sent to us and we want to codify the information, find out a little more about them and their future."

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:23 pm

tute79 wrote:

So Fresno -

I never heard officially that the MIAA split into divisions, but I assume the thinking was that it would be announced before Lindenwood and UNKearney came aboard.
Would you agree the thinking was that the 8 Missouri schools form "the East" and the NE,KS,OK schools form "the West" ?
If so, what are your candidate schools to replace a departing "West" member ?

Are you thinking a 9th Missouri school (and have one slide to the West) ?
Or a school in Western Arkansas (to the West) ?
Plausible...

I agree Chadron is way out west - a problem. OPSU is out west too....
What's the story with Wayne State (I know little about them....)
Could they go after a SD member of the NSIC like Augustana ?

Thanks,
Tute

So far I've heard nothing on divisions, but what you said makes the most sense.

Wayne St. could be an option. They would be the most north team. Since the MIAA went south I just figure they wouldn't want to stretch it any more north. Wayne is the southern most NSIC school and would basically be the same travel in either conf. Arkansas Tech would really be the only Ark option. The rest of the Okla schools seem to like the new conf. and aren't competitive in fb. William Jewel seems like a solid option. Missouri S&T could always comeback. I'm not sure they'd want to. I'd probably put Missouri Southern in the west if they added another eastern school to replace UNO

Here's the D-II map that needs to be updated, if anyone has the software to do so please update it. If you have any questions on who went where ask me. I know where they all go.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/7d/Cbdii.PNG

tute79 · **Joined:** Fri Jun 23, 2006 4:25 pm **Posts:** 1490

Thanks for the info. I especially appreciate information on the smaller schools, since the info is often so hard to find.

I have been maintaining a big speadsheet, that has all the NCAA and NAIA schools by confereneces.
I have them laid out sort of geographically with each college color-coded by state.
I think I'm current, but the D-3 info and NAIA info is scant. That "Senior Reports" looks like a good source.
I started my spreadsheet by using the "membership" tabs on the NCAA and NAIA websites, but of course,
those list give each schools current division / conference, and I update mine to show all the movement that is in the works.

Thanks,
tute

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:17 pm

tute79 wrote:

Thanks for the info. I especially appreciate information on the smaller schools, since the info is often so hard to find.

I have been maintaining a big speadsheet, that has all the NCAA and NAIA schools by confereneces.
I have them laid out sort of geographically with each college color-coded by state.
I think I'm current, but the D-3 info and NAIA info is scant. That "Senior Reports" looks like a good source.
I started my spreadsheet by using the "membership" tabs on the NCAA and NAIA websites, but of course,
those list give each schools current division / conference, and I update mine to show all the movement that is in the works.

Thanks,
tute

Senior Reports is good. I'm on the D-II football message board and the NAIA message board too. Gohokiesfan also knows all about the small schools. If you have any questions I have a notebook with all of the NCAA,NAIA,NCCAA,USCAA,CIS conf. and teams, w/ nicknames.

Fresno St. Alum · **Posted:** Sun Mar 13, 2011 1:54 am

From the land of WTF! UN-Omaha is dropping football & wrestling and accepted the invitation to the Summit. Well I guess UND is stuck in the Sky.

http://omaha.com/article/20110313/NEWS01/703139891

wbyeager · **Posted:** Sun Mar 13, 2011 10:19 am

I wonder how far UNO was out of compliance with Title IX by staying in Division II. Even at 36 scholarships D-II Football sill has far more scholarships than any other sport they offer.

If UNO were to have kept football and/or wrestling, there are not many women's sports to add that would make sense:
* Only a handful of schools west of the Mississippi sponsor field hockey, and all but one of those is in California
* Not many schools sponsor women's bowling, although UNL is one of them and even UNL is a geographic outlier
* Not many schools outside California or the Northeast sponsor women's water polo
* Not many schools sponsor women's or mixed rifle, and very few are nearby
* UNO would easily be the westernmost program to sponsor Women's Ice Hockey, even moreso when considering only Division I schools
* Women's Lacrosse is growing, but most nearby schools offering the sport are Division II or Division III
* Gymnastics does have plenty of nearby competition (including UNL), but may not have enough scholarships
* Women's Rowing would be their best bet, and include competition against Creighton, Drake, Iowa, Kansas, and Kansas State

If UNO were to re-add football, it probably would require adding 3 women's sports unless if Men's Soccer is dropped.

Quinn · **Joined:** Thu Oct 17, 2002 8:05 am **Posts:** 3753

Unreal. Seemed like there was a chance that the Summit/MVFC and UND could all correct an inconvenience. Not now. UND is fine in the Big Sky, but does anyone think they are going to prosper having to travel outside their own timezone, sometimes 2 times zones away, for every sport? Meanwhile, the 3 other Dakota schools are in a comfortable conference footprint that now includes nearby Omaha? Sure, UND will get some better recruits with the "you get to travel to the great land of California every year" which will be a positive selling point with some North Dakota locals. But even the Big Sky was caught off-guard when USD pulled out at the last second. It appeared the Big Sky was building some safety around the idea of Montana and possible others leaving...especially when the rumored schools other than Montana are on the west coast (PSU, Sac St...FB only CP and UCD). Now they really are stuck in the awkward 11/13 membership, not ideal for anyone. And schools like PSU, NAU, and Sac St. must also fly 1000 to 2000 miles for even non-revenue sports. We all joke about the WAC and LA Tech being in that conference. But they at least had the BCS revenue shares to help out. UND made it's bed because it had no other choice...as did the Big Sky...now they both have to deal with it.

Summit League Expansion

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