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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:12 pm 
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hickory_cornhusker wrote:
freaked4collegefb wrote:
USAToday article with comments from ACC Commish regarding "possibility" of significant NCAA restructuring as early as next January.Link at http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nc ... on/2574369" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


So how do you split? Would this be a new subdivision inside Division I for only football (or football and basketball. If basketball as well, does the Big East come along for the ride?)? You can't do a straight split for several sports. Hockey is the first one that comes to mind. I only count nine BCS (sorry, Power Five) schools with men's hockey. Only ten schools have men's lacrosse.


I think what the Power 5 might essentially propose doing is withdrawing the football and possibly men's basketball programs from NCAA competition and creating a new umbrella organization to govern those two sports. I would expect sports like hockey, lacrosse, baseball, track, etc to all stay within the NCAA. There is definitely nothing in the NCAA rule book that requires a school to play football to be an NCAA member and I doubt there is anything in print that mandates men's basketball either--its just kind of a given that everyone in the NCAA plays men's basketball.

If men's basketball were to leave the NCAA things might get kind of dicey though. While the title winner in football from "The Power 5 Athletic Association" is clearly the best team in the country. A NCAA champion from the Big East or one of the high mid-majors like Gonzaga, Wichita St, or the American Conference might be able to claim that their men's basketball team was better than the one crowned by the "Power 5 Athletic Association."


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:54 pm 
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fighting muskie wrote:
hickory_cornhusker wrote:
freaked4collegefb wrote:
USAToday article with comments from ACC Commish regarding "possibility" of significant NCAA restructuring as early as next January.Link at http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nc ... on/2574369" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


So how do you split? Would this be a new subdivision inside Division I for only football (or football and basketball. If basketball as well, does the Big East come along for the ride?)? You can't do a straight split for several sports. Hockey is the first one that comes to mind. I only count nine BCS (sorry, Power Five) schools with men's hockey. Only ten schools have men's lacrosse.


I think what the Power 5 might essentially propose doing is withdrawing the football and possibly men's basketball programs from NCAA competition and creating a new umbrella organization to govern those two sports. I would expect sports like hockey, lacrosse, baseball, track, etc to all stay within the NCAA. There is definitely nothing in the NCAA rule book that requires a school to play football to be an NCAA member and I doubt there is anything in print that mandates men's basketball either--its just kind of a given that everyone in the NCAA plays men's basketball.

If men's basketball were to leave the NCAA things might get kind of dicey though. While the title winner in football from "The Power 5 Athletic Association" is clearly the best team in the country. A NCAA champion from the Big East or one of the high mid-majors like Gonzaga, Wichita St, or the American Conference might be able to claim that their men's basketball team was better than the one crowned by the "Power 5 Athletic Association."

muskie: every D1 schools plays basketball, and I think every D2 schools does too (but I'm not 100% sure on that), but I know there are D3 schools like UT-Brownsville that don't plays Men's basketball.

I have a feeling if this happened, it would be for most of the main 7 sports that are typically sponsored by most schools (maybe they even require them for membership) because they would have to spend the same amount on women to offset the men so these would most likely split from the NCAA...

Football=W Soccer & W Volley
M Basketball=W Basketball
Baseball=Softball (could stay with NCAA but due to the CWS's recent popularity in the ratings I think they'd bring it along for the ride too)

These could go either way as most schools sponsor these...
M/W Track/field, M/W Cross country, M/W Tennis, M/W Golf

And these most likely would stay...
M Soccer, M/W Swimming, M/W LAX, M/W Ice Hockey, W Field Hockey, M Wrestling, W Gymnastics, W Rowing/Crew, W Rifle/Bowling/etc.

So if they do split from the NCAA and hold their own 32 teams March Madness Tourney...do they invite a few more conferences to join them that don't play fb for their bball tourney and CWS? And if so where do they draw the line? Here's my thoughts...

Non fb adds most likely in: Big East, WCC, A10, MVC
On the Bubble: MAAC, SoCon, AmEast
First Out: Big West Southland, Big South, Horizon, OVC, Big Sky
No Shot: HBUs (SWAC/MEAC) Old Guard (Ivy/Patriot) Bottom Feeders (ASun/WAC/NEC/Summit).

All that said if you're adding the "On the Bubble" schools it seems weird to leave out the AAC and the MWC and blackballing and bunch of good basketball schools...same goes for the MAC/CUSA to a lesser extent and makes you wonder if schools like UNLV, New Mexico, SDSU, Utah St, Temple, WKU, Memphis, UConn, Old Dominion, Charlotte would drop football (or at least try to get fb only deal) to be able to be invited back into a conference like the A10 in order to play their primary sport with the Big 5 Schools and company.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 9:53 am 
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ESPN article with comments from Big Ten Commish regarding "possible" future NCAA changes at http://espn.go.com/chicago/college-spor ... eform-plan


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 10:28 am 
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Tklamus-- I didn't think about the fact that if 85 football players and 15 basketball players were being paid stipends for living expenses as part of the new "Division 4" group that it would require 100 female athletes to get similar benefits and whichever sports got those stipends would probably have to withdraw from the NCAA as well. It's really difficult to figure out the logistics of such a separation when you factor in the women.

It's also hard to say wether or not the Power 5 would entertain letting conferences join their special group for basketball. Those 5 would have all the power and be able to dictate who got in. I'm inclined to think that they wouldn't let anyone join their elite club no matter how elite their basketball pedigree is.

This would mean that that the BE, American, and MWC would be the cream of the NCAA tournament with WCC, A10, and MVC schools occasionally making strong runs


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 5:50 pm 
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Everything that Bowlsby, Swofford, Slive, and Delany said boils down to:

Create a new NCAA classification (and NOT leave the NCAA).

Think of it as "Super Division I" (because that's easier than talking about it with Division 4 being the current D3, etc).

Super Division I would be:
-- FBS Football Schools (all the conferences. Number of teams TBD based on who says "We can afford that" and who says "We can't" and drops to FCS).

Division I would be:
-- FCS schools
-- Division I non-football schools.

Super Division I would have the same membership requirements as FBS football's classification:
-- seven sports for men and seven for women or six for men and eight for women, with at least two team sports for each gender.
-- financial aid minimums
-- 85 football scholarships
-- 15,000 minimum football average attendance
-- etc


This would be catastrophic for the non-football schools. They'd basically be kicked out of Division I into Division II.

And people should see this for what it is: Yet another money/power grab.

The BCS Conferences all have freshly signed TV deals, they're the haves and crush the have-nots.... in almost everything but men's basketball!
There's one way for them to get more money: Stop giving 40-50 NCAA Tournament Units to the schools without football scholarships like Wichita State, VCU, Butler, George Mason, Gonzaga, Xavier and Marquette!

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:21 pm 
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Pete Thamel piece discussing what is causing the building movement for NCAA leadership change at http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/colleg ... ore-change


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 25, 2013 6:48 pm 
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Indy Star article with comments from NCAA President regarding move to change NCAA D-1 goverance structure at http://www.indystar.com/article/2013072 ... les-policy


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2013 10:17 am 
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All this brings up more questions than answers. It's certainly a ploy as it pertains to money and control, but something seismic shall happen. While the power conferences are making the thrust, the networks are behind it even more deeply.

That said, the NCAA does need major revisions in some constructive way. But there could be big damage with all this too if not done more thoughtful all-around. Here's an interesting perspective:

(John Clay - Lexington Herald-Leader - 7/30/2013)
http://www.thenewstribune.com/2013/07/2 ... n-the.html


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 02, 2013 3:17 pm 
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Dennis Dodd blog article discussing possible NCAA D-4 at http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootbal ... mains-same" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


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PostPosted: Mon Aug 05, 2013 9:18 am 
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NYTimes article with comments from various conference commissioners regarding possible future NCAA D-1 changes at http://nytimes.com/2013/08/05/sports/nc ... .html?_r=0


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2013 3:30 pm 
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Here are my latest musings about a 16-team super conferences--I think they work better than the 20-team ones discussed elsewhere:

The Big 12 agrees to be liquidated and the other 4 conferences agree to be flexible and work together to make things work:

Pac 12 adds Texas, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, and Oklahoma St
Big Ten adds Iowa St, Kansas, and Kansas St
SEC adds Baylor and TCU
ACC adds West Virginia
Big Ten gives Maryland and Rutgers to the ACC
SEC gives the Big Ten Missouri
ACC gives SEC Louisville

Each team creates 2 8-yeam divisions or 4 4-team pods format, whichever is more convenient for that league. Have mini playoffs within each of the 4 conferences with the 4 winners advancing to the National Playoffs. That way it gives each region a chance to be represented. Sure there is the argument that some divisions/conferences would be harder than others but the same is so in the NFL and it works out okay.

The noticeable left out program in Notre Dame and I suppose their are ways to fit them into the ACC or Big Ten but it require leaving someone out somewhere else or one conference having an extra member


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:45 pm 
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I don't see any of this happening. The P12 gets the big 4 programs? Hardly an equitable split.
The B1G has no interest in Iowa State or Kansas State
SEC is not interested in Baylor or TCU. They might be interested in Texas but A&M would fight to block that.
WV will never be in the ACC. (mutual hatred)
B1G/BTN won't give up MD/DC/NJ unless there is a major shift in the way cable is distributed.
Missouri is still stinging from being snubbed by the B1G. They are not leaving the SEC.
SEC doesn't want Louisville. They have a team in Ky. The SEC wants a team in NC and VA.
I would love to see MD and Rutgers in the ACC, but I don't see that happening.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 2:36 pm 
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Finally can shut this all down! Someone around Tulane has figured it all out, with new conference names, division names, and new logos. :shock: :roll:

http://coalition.tulane.edu/ideas37.pdf


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2013 6:05 pm 
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USAToday article with comments from Wake Forest President regarding ongoing NCAA D-1 governance change discussions at http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/co ... ng/3297215


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